Poland and Ukraine getting stronger economically

Poland already passed Greece in GDP per capita and Polands leaders expects Poland pass Portugal in GDP per capita in 2019. Poland could pass Italy in GDP per capita within 10 years.

They need to be referring to GDP per capita in a purchasing power parity (PPP) basis.

Poland’s GDP PPP Per capita is forecasted to be 31,430.02 PPP Intl $ in Dec 2018 as reported by International Monetary Fund – World Economic Outlook. It records an increase from the last reported number of 29,521.25 PPP Intl $ in Dec 2017. Looking ahead, Poland’s GDP PPP Per Capita is projected to stand at 40,123.13 PPP Intl $ in Dec 2023.

GDP per capita in Poland is expected to be 16200 USD by the end of this quarter, according to Trading Economics global macro models and analysts expectations. Poland GDP per capita is projected to trend around 17200 USD in 2020.

GDP per capita in Portugal is expected to be 23700.00 USD by the end of this quarter, according to Trading Economics global macro models and analysts expectations. In the long-term, the Portugal GDP per capita is projected to trend around 25100.00 USD in 2020, according to our econometric models.

IMF expects Ukraine to recover

The IMF expects, GDP per capita in Ukraine to grow 1.5 times by 2023 to $ 4,220 per capita.

287 thoughts on “Poland and Ukraine getting stronger economically”

  1. How can you ( people ) compare Poland`s GDP in US $ without eliminating currency rate fluctuations and worker`s salary difference . It is impossible to compare . One year it was 3 zł for 1$ now it is 3.7 $ . For some of you -Economists Poland s economy shrinked $ . Oh Lord – Glockman said “Sorry no, but Poland’s GDP was the same in 2017 as it was in 2013.”
    According to the Minister of Finance, Poland currently belongs to those countries in the European Union, which have the lowest unemployment rate. Moreover, according to the President of the CSO, Dominik Rozkruta, the dynamics of GDP growth in Poland is twice as high as the average for the European Union. In Poland, GDP growth has been continuous for 23 years. This increase is quite fast, as it is 4.2 percent on average. annually. We are a country in Europe that has the longest growth in gross domestic product (GDP) recorded in statistics.https://damprace.pl/pkb-polski-w-latach-1997-2017/.

    If Poland was not colonised , we would have similar salaries to western Europe by 2025 and our nominal GDP would skyrocket to 2 trillion of US $ in 2025 . Unles we repolonize our economy , western owners will never allow salaries to grow in Poland .

    Reply
  2. Based on history, population, economy and location to the fight I would disagree. Germany, just one European country, did take on most of the world including the US and barely lost. The main idea behind NATO is overwhelming defensive force so no one gets any wise ideas.

    Reply
  3. Based on history population economy and location to the fight I would disagree. Germany just one European country did take on most of the world including the US and barely lost. The main idea behind NATO is overwhelming defensive force so no one gets any wise ideas.

    Reply
  4. Well, we could endlessly debate PPP, but the plateauing I was looking at was both in EUR and USD terms (the former more important for Poland). Nominally PLN is immaterial unless you inflation adjust it. Anyhow, take your PPP and compare it to rest of Europe, especially where Poland aspires to be. It will take about 25 years to get there (assuming the same growth rates, even in PPP-land). China I don’t trust their numbers, and neither do they (see remarks from PBOC). And on their base, whether it’s 5 or 9% will take about 30 years or so to catch up to middle-class levels.

    Reply
  5. Well we could endlessly debate PPP but the plateauing I was looking at was both in EUR and USD terms (the former more important for Poland). Nominally PLN is immaterial unless you inflation adjust it. Anyhow take your PPP and compare it to rest of Europe especially where Poland aspires to be. It will take about 25 years to get there (assuming the same growth rates even in PPP-land).China I don’t trust their numbers and neither do they (see remarks from PBOC). And on their base whether it’s 5 or 9{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} will take about 30 years or so to catch up to middle-class levels.

    Reply
  6. You’re looking at nominal GDP numbers, they’re changing mainly because of $ exchange rates any given year are fluctuating. Currently because Trump’s politics $ should be growing stronger in next few years and most countries GDP nominal will be shrinking significantly but it doesn’t mean that their productivity is shrinking. Productivity(which show true wealth of a country) is growing quite fast, on average 6% per year in most countries. GDP growth is measured better in PPP GDP which is growing more than 6% per year in Poland. In USA, if you’re growing 2,5% in GDP nominal, you’re also growing the same 2,5% in PPP. In other countries like for example China, they’re growing 6,7% in nominal, but if you want to see real dynamics of their economy you should compare PPP. In 2017 and now 2018 they will produce almost 9% more products and services wealth than last year. So China is now slowing not like many people think from 7-8% to 6,5% but from 11-12% to current 9%. Once again, my point is that comparing economies, as more and more economists admit we should look at PPP GDP not nominal GDP.

    Reply
  7. You’re looking at nominal GDP numbers they’re changing mainly because of $ exchange rates any given year are fluctuating. Currently because Trump’s politics $ should be growing stronger in next few years and most countries GDP nominal will be shrinking significantly but it doesn’t mean that their productivity is shrinking. Productivity(which show true wealth of a country) is growing quite fast on average 6{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year in most countries.GDP growth is measured better in PPP GDP which is growing more than 6{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year in Poland.In USA if you’re growing 25{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in GDP nominal you’re also growing the same 25{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in PPP.In other countries like for example China they’re growing 67{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in nominal but if you want to see real dynamics of their economy you should compare PPP. In 2017 and now 2018 they will produce almost 9{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} more products and services wealth than last year.So China is now slowing not like many people think from 7-8{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} to 65{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} but from 11-12{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} to current 9{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}.Once again my point is that comparing economies as more and more economists admit we should look at PPP GDP not nominal GDP.

    Reply
  8. I guess it did level off for a while, my bad. When Poland left Russian sphere of influence it was growing at 6 or 7% in the 90th when Russian economy was falling of the cliff. Polish economy was smaller than Ukraine in the 80th and look at them now. I hope people will understand that countries in the Soviet and now Russian sphere of influence were economically deprived.

    Reply
  9. I guess it did level off for a while my bad. When Poland left Russian sphere of influence it was growing at 6 or 7{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in the 90th when Russian economy was falling of the cliff. Polish economy was smaller than Ukraine in the 80th and look at them now. I hope people will understand that countries in the Soviet and now Russian sphere of influence were economically deprived.

    Reply
  10. Not going to argue that. Nonetheless Ukraine is becoming and IT start up hub and already exceeded most countries in venture money going to new Ukrainian IT start ups. The growth in this are over the last 3 years has been astronomical

    Reply
  11. Not going to argue that. Nonetheless Ukraine is becoming and IT start up hub and already exceeded most countries in venture money going to new Ukrainian IT start ups. The growth in this are over the last 3 years has been astronomical

    Reply
  12. btw, I vested in Ukraine because we required some excellent local engineers. The talent pool is very deep and it was the right decision. Could never have run the business from outside the country nor without them.

    Reply
  13. btw I vested in Ukraine because we required some excellent local engineers. The talent pool is very deep and it was the right decision. Could never have run the business from outside the country nor without them.

    Reply
  14. yes I know the propaganda from them, every country has the same. One of my businesses has an office in Kiev (by Mariinsky park) so I know reality and I know bs. World bank ranks Ukraine as 137 of 185 in ease of doing business. There is a LOT of paperwork. You need to budget about 30% more for “extraordinary items”. But I still do business there. I can’t invest any real capital locally because there isn’t any real rule of law, our contracts aren’t enforceable (not in any practical sense). That in itself is a major drawback, huge. It’s a frontier economy and should be handled that way.

    Reply
  15. yes I know the propaganda from them every country has the same. One of my businesses has an office in Kiev (by Mariinsky park) so I know reality and I know bs. World bank ranks Ukraine as 137 of 185 in ease of doing business. There is a LOT of paperwork. You need to budget about 30{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} more for extraordinary items””. But I still do business there. I can’t invest any real capital locally because there isn’t any real rule of law”” our contracts aren’t enforceable (not in any practical sense). That in itself is a major drawback”” huge. It’s a frontier economy and should be handled that way.”””

    Reply
  16. Sorry no, but Poland’s GDP was the same in 2017 as it was in 2013. From 2012 (in USD): 500/524/545/477/471/524. Now, 2018 looks very good with a projected GDP of about 614bn. So Poland does NOT grow about 4% per year. The comeback from 2014/15 is impressive. And where they came from 25 years ago is even more so. Poland’s GDP/Capita was the same in 2017 as it was in 2008. But so is Germany, Netherlands, and Hungary, not to mention all the EU (world bank data). For Poland to break into the middle class of EU, it needs to grow 3x faster than the rest of the “middle class” countries of the EU (which doesn’t mean Portugal) for a very long time. Example: For Poland to reach EU GDP/Capita mean, growing 6% per year while EU grows 2%, then it will take 24 years for Poland to catch up. Obviously much faster if the EU Mean doesn’t grow at all (unlikely). This is what we call “middle income trap”. That is, countries who experience very fast growth come to a point where they plateau (basically low hanging fruit of FDI+infrastructure+reforms) and to keep growing just as fast is extremely difficult. Many, many countries are in this position (like China and nearly all of eastern and southern Europe). I’ve read the Polish government investment plans and I see nothing there that indicates they have a long-term growth plan.

    Reply
  17. Sorry no but Poland’s GDP was the same in 2017 as it was in 2013. From 2012 (in USD): 500/524/545/477/471/524. Now 2018 looks very good with a projected GDP of about 614bn. So Poland does NOT grow about 4{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year. The comeback from 2014/15 is impressive. And where they came from 25 years ago is even more so. Poland’s GDP/Capita was the same in 2017 as it was in 2008. But so is Germany Netherlands and Hungary not to mention all the EU (world bank data).For Poland to break into the middle class of EU it needs to grow 3x faster than the rest of the middle class”” countries of the EU (which doesn’t mean Portugal) for a very long time. Example: For Poland to reach EU GDP/Capita mean”” growing 6{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year while EU grows 2{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}”” then it will take 24 years for Poland to catch up. Obviously much faster if the EU Mean doesn’t grow at all (unlikely). This is what we call “”””middle income trap””””. That is”” countries who experience very fast growth come to a point where they plateau (basically low hanging fruit of FDI+infrastructure+reforms) and to keep growing just as fast is extremely difficult. Many”” many countries are in this position (like China and nearly all of eastern and southern Europe). I’ve read the Polish government investment plans and I see nothing there that indicates they have a long-term growth plan.”””

    Reply
  18. Ukraine offers a myriad of benefits for international tech startups: the lowest operating costs in Europe, professionals with European sensibilities, easy-to-obtain work permits and no visa requirements, and streamlined recruiting hiring processes, among others.” Does not let me to provide a link.

    Reply
  19. Ukraine offers a myriad of benefits for international tech startups: the lowest operating costs in Europe professionals with European sensibilities easy-to-obtain work permits and no visa requirements and streamlined recruiting hiring processes” among others.”” Does not let me to provide a link.”””

    Reply
  20. GDP in Poland has not leveled off and keeps growing at about 4% per year. Business climate in Ukraine has actually been praised in recent years and is one of the reasons Ukraine has become IT startup hub.

    Reply
  21. GDP in Poland has not leveled off and keeps growing at about 4{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year. Business climate in Ukraine has actually been praised in recent years and is one of the reasons Ukraine has become IT startup hub.

    Reply
  22. Based on history, population, economy and location to the fight I would disagree. Germany, just one European country, did take on most of the world including the US and barely lost. The main idea behind NATO is overwhelming defensive force so no one gets any wise ideas.

    Reply
  23. Based on history population economy and location to the fight I would disagree. Germany just one European country did take on most of the world including the US and barely lost. The main idea behind NATO is overwhelming defensive force so no one gets any wise ideas.

    Reply
  24. Well, we could endlessly debate PPP, but the plateauing I was looking at was both in EUR and USD terms (the former more important for Poland). Nominally PLN is immaterial unless you inflation adjust it. Anyhow, take your PPP and compare it to rest of Europe, especially where Poland aspires to be. It will take about 25 years to get there (assuming the same growth rates, even in PPP-land). China I don’t trust their numbers, and neither do they (see remarks from PBOC). And on their base, whether it’s 5 or 9% will take about 30 years or so to catch up to middle-class levels.

    Reply
  25. Well we could endlessly debate PPP but the plateauing I was looking at was both in EUR and USD terms (the former more important for Poland). Nominally PLN is immaterial unless you inflation adjust it. Anyhow take your PPP and compare it to rest of Europe especially where Poland aspires to be. It will take about 25 years to get there (assuming the same growth rates even in PPP-land).China I don’t trust their numbers and neither do they (see remarks from PBOC). And on their base whether it’s 5 or 9{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} will take about 30 years or so to catch up to middle-class levels.

    Reply
  26. Based on history, population, economy and location to the fight I would disagree. Germany, just one European country, did take on most of the world including the US and barely lost.

    The main idea behind NATO is overwhelming defensive force so no one gets any wise ideas.

    Reply
  27. You’re looking at nominal GDP numbers, they’re changing mainly because of $ exchange rates any given year are fluctuating. Currently because Trump’s politics $ should be growing stronger in next few years and most countries GDP nominal will be shrinking significantly but it doesn’t mean that their productivity is shrinking. Productivity(which show true wealth of a country) is growing quite fast, on average 6% per year in most countries. GDP growth is measured better in PPP GDP which is growing more than 6% per year in Poland. In USA, if you’re growing 2,5% in GDP nominal, you’re also growing the same 2,5% in PPP. In other countries like for example China, they’re growing 6,7% in nominal, but if you want to see real dynamics of their economy you should compare PPP. In 2017 and now 2018 they will produce almost 9% more products and services wealth than last year. So China is now slowing not like many people think from 7-8% to 6,5% but from 11-12% to current 9%. Once again, my point is that comparing economies, as more and more economists admit we should look at PPP GDP not nominal GDP.

    Reply
  28. You’re looking at nominal GDP numbers they’re changing mainly because of $ exchange rates any given year are fluctuating. Currently because Trump’s politics $ should be growing stronger in next few years and most countries GDP nominal will be shrinking significantly but it doesn’t mean that their productivity is shrinking. Productivity(which show true wealth of a country) is growing quite fast on average 6{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year in most countries.GDP growth is measured better in PPP GDP which is growing more than 6{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year in Poland.In USA if you’re growing 25{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in GDP nominal you’re also growing the same 25{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in PPP.In other countries like for example China they’re growing 67{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in nominal but if you want to see real dynamics of their economy you should compare PPP. In 2017 and now 2018 they will produce almost 9{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} more products and services wealth than last year.So China is now slowing not like many people think from 7-8{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} to 65{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} but from 11-12{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} to current 9{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}.Once again my point is that comparing economies as more and more economists admit we should look at PPP GDP not nominal GDP.

    Reply
  29. I guess it did level off for a while, my bad. When Poland left Russian sphere of influence it was growing at 6 or 7% in the 90th when Russian economy was falling of the cliff. Polish economy was smaller than Ukraine in the 80th and look at them now. I hope people will understand that countries in the Soviet and now Russian sphere of influence were economically deprived.

    Reply
  30. I guess it did level off for a while my bad. When Poland left Russian sphere of influence it was growing at 6 or 7{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in the 90th when Russian economy was falling of the cliff. Polish economy was smaller than Ukraine in the 80th and look at them now. I hope people will understand that countries in the Soviet and now Russian sphere of influence were economically deprived.

    Reply
  31. Not going to argue that. Nonetheless Ukraine is becoming and IT start up hub and already exceeded most countries in venture money going to new Ukrainian IT start ups. The growth in this are over the last 3 years has been astronomical

    Reply
  32. Not going to argue that. Nonetheless Ukraine is becoming and IT start up hub and already exceeded most countries in venture money going to new Ukrainian IT start ups. The growth in this are over the last 3 years has been astronomical

    Reply
  33. btw, I vested in Ukraine because we required some excellent local engineers. The talent pool is very deep and it was the right decision. Could never have run the business from outside the country nor without them.

    Reply
  34. btw I vested in Ukraine because we required some excellent local engineers. The talent pool is very deep and it was the right decision. Could never have run the business from outside the country nor without them.

    Reply
  35. yes I know the propaganda from them, every country has the same. One of my businesses has an office in Kiev (by Mariinsky park) so I know reality and I know bs. World bank ranks Ukraine as 137 of 185 in ease of doing business. There is a LOT of paperwork. You need to budget about 30% more for “extraordinary items”. But I still do business there. I can’t invest any real capital locally because there isn’t any real rule of law, our contracts aren’t enforceable (not in any practical sense). That in itself is a major drawback, huge. It’s a frontier economy and should be handled that way.

    Reply
  36. yes I know the propaganda from them every country has the same. One of my businesses has an office in Kiev (by Mariinsky park) so I know reality and I know bs. World bank ranks Ukraine as 137 of 185 in ease of doing business. There is a LOT of paperwork. You need to budget about 30{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} more for extraordinary items””. But I still do business there. I can’t invest any real capital locally because there isn’t any real rule of law”” our contracts aren’t enforceable (not in any practical sense). That in itself is a major drawback”” huge. It’s a frontier economy and should be handled that way.”””

    Reply
  37. Sorry no, but Poland’s GDP was the same in 2017 as it was in 2013. From 2012 (in USD): 500/524/545/477/471/524. Now, 2018 looks very good with a projected GDP of about 614bn. So Poland does NOT grow about 4% per year. The comeback from 2014/15 is impressive. And where they came from 25 years ago is even more so. Poland’s GDP/Capita was the same in 2017 as it was in 2008. But so is Germany, Netherlands, and Hungary, not to mention all the EU (world bank data). For Poland to break into the middle class of EU, it needs to grow 3x faster than the rest of the “middle class” countries of the EU (which doesn’t mean Portugal) for a very long time. Example: For Poland to reach EU GDP/Capita mean, growing 6% per year while EU grows 2%, then it will take 24 years for Poland to catch up. Obviously much faster if the EU Mean doesn’t grow at all (unlikely). This is what we call “middle income trap”. That is, countries who experience very fast growth come to a point where they plateau (basically low hanging fruit of FDI+infrastructure+reforms) and to keep growing just as fast is extremely difficult. Many, many countries are in this position (like China and nearly all of eastern and southern Europe). I’ve read the Polish government investment plans and I see nothing there that indicates they have a long-term growth plan.

    Reply
  38. Sorry no but Poland’s GDP was the same in 2017 as it was in 2013. From 2012 (in USD): 500/524/545/477/471/524. Now 2018 looks very good with a projected GDP of about 614bn. So Poland does NOT grow about 4{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year. The comeback from 2014/15 is impressive. And where they came from 25 years ago is even more so. Poland’s GDP/Capita was the same in 2017 as it was in 2008. But so is Germany Netherlands and Hungary not to mention all the EU (world bank data).For Poland to break into the middle class of EU it needs to grow 3x faster than the rest of the middle class”” countries of the EU (which doesn’t mean Portugal) for a very long time. Example: For Poland to reach EU GDP/Capita mean”” growing 6{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year while EU grows 2{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}”” then it will take 24 years for Poland to catch up. Obviously much faster if the EU Mean doesn’t grow at all (unlikely). This is what we call “”””middle income trap””””. That is”” countries who experience very fast growth come to a point where they plateau (basically low hanging fruit of FDI+infrastructure+reforms) and to keep growing just as fast is extremely difficult. Many”” many countries are in this position (like China and nearly all of eastern and southern Europe). I’ve read the Polish government investment plans and I see nothing there that indicates they have a long-term growth plan.”””

    Reply
  39. Ukraine offers a myriad of benefits for international tech startups: the lowest operating costs in Europe, professionals with European sensibilities, easy-to-obtain work permits and no visa requirements, and streamlined recruiting hiring processes, among others.” Does not let me to provide a link.

    Reply
  40. Ukraine offers a myriad of benefits for international tech startups: the lowest operating costs in Europe professionals with European sensibilities easy-to-obtain work permits and no visa requirements and streamlined recruiting hiring processes” among others.”” Does not let me to provide a link.”””

    Reply
  41. GDP in Poland has not leveled off and keeps growing at about 4% per year. Business climate in Ukraine has actually been praised in recent years and is one of the reasons Ukraine has become IT startup hub.

    Reply
  42. GDP in Poland has not leveled off and keeps growing at about 4{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} per year. Business climate in Ukraine has actually been praised in recent years and is one of the reasons Ukraine has become IT startup hub.

    Reply
  43. Well, we could endlessly debate PPP, but the plateauing I was looking at was both in EUR and USD terms (the former more important for Poland). Nominally PLN is immaterial unless you inflation adjust it. Anyhow, take your PPP and compare it to rest of Europe, especially where Poland aspires to be. It will take about 25 years to get there (assuming the same growth rates, even in PPP-land).

    China I don’t trust their numbers, and neither do they (see remarks from PBOC). And on their base, whether it’s 5 or 9% will take about 30 years or so to catch up to middle-class levels.

    Reply
  44. You’re looking at nominal GDP numbers, they’re changing mainly because of $ exchange rates any given year are fluctuating. Currently because Trump’s politics $ should be growing stronger in next few years and most countries GDP nominal will be shrinking significantly but it doesn’t mean that their productivity is shrinking. Productivity(which show true wealth of a country) is growing quite fast, on average 6% per year in most countries.

    GDP growth is measured better in PPP GDP which is growing more than 6% per year in Poland.

    In USA, if you’re growing 2,5% in GDP nominal, you’re also growing the same 2,5% in PPP.

    In other countries like for example China, they’re growing 6,7% in nominal, but if you want to see real dynamics of their economy you should compare PPP. In 2017 and now 2018 they will produce almost 9% more products and services wealth than last year.

    So China is now slowing not like many people think from 7-8% to 6,5% but from 11-12% to current 9%.

    Once again, my point is that comparing economies, as more and more economists admit we should look at PPP GDP not nominal GDP.

    Reply
  45. I guess it did level off for a while, my bad. When Poland left Russian sphere of influence it was growing at 6 or 7% in the 90th when Russian economy was falling of the cliff. Polish economy was smaller than Ukraine in the 80th and look at them now. I hope people will understand that countries in the Soviet and now Russian sphere of influence were economically deprived.

    Reply
  46. Not going to argue that. Nonetheless Ukraine is becoming and IT start up hub and already exceeded most countries in venture money going to new Ukrainian IT start ups. The growth in this are over the last 3 years has been astronomical

    Reply
  47. btw, I vested in Ukraine because we required some excellent local engineers. The talent pool is very deep and it was the right decision. Could never have run the business from outside the country nor without them.

    Reply
  48. yes I know the propaganda from them, every country has the same. One of my businesses has an office in Kiev (by Mariinsky park) so I know reality and I know bs. World bank ranks Ukraine as 137 of 185 in ease of doing business. There is a LOT of paperwork. You need to budget about 30% more for “extraordinary items”. But I still do business there. I can’t invest any real capital locally because there isn’t any real rule of law, our contracts aren’t enforceable (not in any practical sense). That in itself is a major drawback, huge. It’s a frontier economy and should be handled that way.

    Reply
  49. Sorry no, but Poland’s GDP was the same in 2017 as it was in 2013. From 2012 (in USD): 500/524/545/477/471/524. Now, 2018 looks very good with a projected GDP of about 614bn. So Poland does NOT grow about 4% per year. The comeback from 2014/15 is impressive. And where they came from 25 years ago is even more so. Poland’s GDP/Capita was the same in 2017 as it was in 2008. But so is Germany, Netherlands, and Hungary, not to mention all the EU (world bank data).

    For Poland to break into the middle class of EU, it needs to grow 3x faster than the rest of the “middle class” countries of the EU (which doesn’t mean Portugal) for a very long time. Example: For Poland to reach EU GDP/Capita mean, growing 6% per year while EU grows 2%, then it will take 24 years for Poland to catch up. Obviously much faster if the EU Mean doesn’t grow at all (unlikely). This is what we call “middle income trap”. That is, countries who experience very fast growth come to a point where they plateau (basically low hanging fruit of FDI+infrastructure+reforms) and to keep growing just as fast is extremely difficult. Many, many countries are in this position (like China and nearly all of eastern and southern Europe). I’ve read the Polish government investment plans and I see nothing there that indicates they have a long-term growth plan.

    Reply
  50. So what? Shows how desperate the Poles are to be further backed up by the US military, not less. And we shouldn’t take the bait. We should cut a deal with Russia designating what is their close regional sphere of influence and what is ours, and leave the Poles to their geopolitical fate from that. There is NO LONGER ANY VIABLE argument for risking cities named ‘Boston’ and ‘Chicago’ for protecting Poland. None. So what if Russia becomes a regional power. It is not the Soviet Union. It is not a world threat to us. Hell, by having to deal with occupied territories it will be bogged down in constant guerilla warfare and that is a net positive for us, geopolitically speaking.

    Reply
  51. So what? Shows how desperate the Poles are to be further backed up by the US military not less.And we shouldn’t take the bait. We should cut a deal with Russia designating what is their close regional sphere of influence and what is ours and leave the Poles to their geopolitical fate from that.There is NO LONGER ANY VIABLE argument for risking cities named ‘Boston’ and ‘Chicago’ for protecting Poland. None. So what if Russia becomes a regional power. It is not the Soviet Union. It is not a world threat to us. Hell by having to deal with occupied territories it will be bogged down in constant guerilla warfare and that is a net positive for us geopolitically speaking.

    Reply
  52. So what? Shows how desperate the Poles are to be further backed up by the US military, not less. And we shouldn’t take the bait. We should cut a deal with Russia designating what is their close regional sphere of influence and what is ours, and leave the Poles to their geopolitical fate from that. There is NO LONGER ANY VIABLE argument for risking cities named ‘Boston’ and ‘Chicago’ for protecting Poland. None. So what if Russia becomes a regional power. It is not the Soviet Union. It is not a world threat to us. Hell, by having to deal with occupied territories it will be bogged down in constant guerilla warfare and that is a net positive for us, geopolitically speaking.

    Reply
  53. So what? Shows how desperate the Poles are to be further backed up by the US military not less.And we shouldn’t take the bait. We should cut a deal with Russia designating what is their close regional sphere of influence and what is ours and leave the Poles to their geopolitical fate from that.There is NO LONGER ANY VIABLE argument for risking cities named ‘Boston’ and ‘Chicago’ for protecting Poland. None. So what if Russia becomes a regional power. It is not the Soviet Union. It is not a world threat to us. Hell by having to deal with occupied territories it will be bogged down in constant guerilla warfare and that is a net positive for us geopolitically speaking.

    Reply
  54. Russian soldiers also gang-raped every Polish woman they found. Daily. Didn’t matter how young, or old. So, aren’t like a 1/3 of modern day Poles have at least 1/4 Russian blood in them now?

    Reply
  55. Russian soldiers also gang-raped every Polish woman they found. Daily. Didn’t matter how young or old.So aren’t like a 1/3 of modern day Poles have at least 1/4 Russian blood in them now?

    Reply
  56. Russian soldiers also gang-raped every Polish woman they found. Daily. Didn’t matter how young, or old. So, aren’t like a 1/3 of modern day Poles have at least 1/4 Russian blood in them now?

    Reply
  57. Russian soldiers also gang-raped every Polish woman they found. Daily. Didn’t matter how young or old.So aren’t like a 1/3 of modern day Poles have at least 1/4 Russian blood in them now?

    Reply
  58. What is amazing about Ukraine’s growth is that it is happening in the middle of a civil war (currently low level but still going on).

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  59. What is amazing about Ukraine’s growth is that it is happening in the middle of a civil war (currently low level but still going on).

    Reply
  60. What is amazing about Ukraine’s growth is that it is happening in the middle of a civil war (currently low level but still going on).

    Reply
  61. What is amazing about Ukraine’s growth is that it is happening in the middle of a civil war (currently low level but still going on).

    Reply
  62. Getting into political debates about these 2 countries is a losing proposition. Reminds me when I mistakenly called a Belarus a White Russian (a bad mistake, since it doesn’t mean that). Poland has grown tremendously, but I wonder if it can be sustained. GDP has leveled off the past few years, as has GDP/capita. Can Poland break out of the middle income trap? I doubt it. Poland needs to re-industrialize if you will (with lots of foreign capital). That means competing with everyone else in the same boat. I just can’t see the selling proposition. Which is too bad, I found the Poles among the hardest working and industrious anywhere (and a beautiful lakes district and beaches) . They have a lot going for them (geography, education, work ethic) but the latest plateauing doesn’t point in the right direction. btw, the topic of EU transfers is not that important in the big scheme of things, representing about 2.5% of GDP, it helps, but not material (and compared to Germany’s domestic energy subsidies a rounding error). Ukraine is a completely different animal. It imports energy and outputs steel and agri. To me (been in and around Kiev a few times), it’s got to step up to the plate if they ever want to get into the middle income. It means serious reform of the agri sector (which could be huge though Europe doesn’t want it) and some semblance of a decent business climate. It seems the officials go out of their way to discourage FDI.

    Reply
  63. Getting into political debates about these 2 countries is a losing proposition. Reminds me when I mistakenly called a Belarus a White Russian (a bad mistake since it doesn’t mean that). Poland has grown tremendously but I wonder if it can be sustained. GDP has leveled off the past few years as has GDP/capita. Can Poland break out of the middle income trap? I doubt it. Poland needs to re-industrialize if you will (with lots of foreign capital). That means competing with everyone else in the same boat. I just can’t see the selling proposition. Which is too bad I found the Poles among the hardest working and industrious anywhere (and a beautiful lakes district and beaches) . They have a lot going for them (geography education work ethic) but the latest plateauing doesn’t point in the right direction. btw the topic of EU transfers is not that important in the big scheme of things representing about 2.5{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of GDP it helps but not material (and compared to Germany’s domestic energy subsidies a rounding error). Ukraine is a completely different animal. It imports energy and outputs steel and agri. To me (been in and around Kiev a few times) it’s got to step up to the plate if they ever want to get into the middle income. It means serious reform of the agri sector (which could be huge though Europe doesn’t want it) and some semblance of a decent business climate. It seems the officials go out of their way to discourage FDI.

    Reply
  64. Getting into political debates about these 2 countries is a losing proposition. Reminds me when I mistakenly called a Belarus a White Russian (a bad mistake, since it doesn’t mean that). Poland has grown tremendously, but I wonder if it can be sustained. GDP has leveled off the past few years, as has GDP/capita. Can Poland break out of the middle income trap? I doubt it. Poland needs to re-industrialize if you will (with lots of foreign capital). That means competing with everyone else in the same boat. I just can’t see the selling proposition. Which is too bad, I found the Poles among the hardest working and industrious anywhere (and a beautiful lakes district and beaches) . They have a lot going for them (geography, education, work ethic) but the latest plateauing doesn’t point in the right direction. btw, the topic of EU transfers is not that important in the big scheme of things, representing about 2.5% of GDP, it helps, but not material (and compared to Germany’s domestic energy subsidies a rounding error). Ukraine is a completely different animal. It imports energy and outputs steel and agri. To me (been in and around Kiev a few times), it’s got to step up to the plate if they ever want to get into the middle income. It means serious reform of the agri sector (which could be huge though Europe doesn’t want it) and some semblance of a decent business climate. It seems the officials go out of their way to discourage FDI.

    Reply
  65. Getting into political debates about these 2 countries is a losing proposition. Reminds me when I mistakenly called a Belarus a White Russian (a bad mistake since it doesn’t mean that). Poland has grown tremendously but I wonder if it can be sustained. GDP has leveled off the past few years as has GDP/capita. Can Poland break out of the middle income trap? I doubt it. Poland needs to re-industrialize if you will (with lots of foreign capital). That means competing with everyone else in the same boat. I just can’t see the selling proposition. Which is too bad I found the Poles among the hardest working and industrious anywhere (and a beautiful lakes district and beaches) . They have a lot going for them (geography education work ethic) but the latest plateauing doesn’t point in the right direction. btw the topic of EU transfers is not that important in the big scheme of things representing about 2.5{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of GDP it helps but not material (and compared to Germany’s domestic energy subsidies a rounding error). Ukraine is a completely different animal. It imports energy and outputs steel and agri. To me (been in and around Kiev a few times) it’s got to step up to the plate if they ever want to get into the middle income. It means serious reform of the agri sector (which could be huge though Europe doesn’t want it) and some semblance of a decent business climate. It seems the officials go out of their way to discourage FDI.

    Reply
  66. The Donbass voted for the candidate that promised conservative policies and pro Russian policies. The people of Donbass may be Ukrainian majority, but 40% are Russian. They left Ukraine and declared independence, because Ukraine overthrew the democratically elected candidate. The equivalent would by a violent coup overthrowing Trump, and all the pro trump states declaring independence. Yanukovych won every district in the Donbass and was then overthrown in a illegal coup

    Reply
  67. The Donbass voted for the candidate that promised conservative policies and pro Russian policies. The people of Donbass may be Ukrainian majority but 40{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} are Russian. They left Ukraine and declared independence because Ukraine overthrew the democratically elected candidate. The equivalent would by a violent coup overthrowing Trump and all the pro trump states declaring independence. Yanukovych won every district in the Donbass and was then overthrown in a illegal coup

    Reply
  68. The Donbass voted for the candidate that promised conservative policies and pro Russian policies. The people of Donbass may be Ukrainian majority, but 40% are Russian. They left Ukraine and declared independence, because Ukraine overthrew the democratically elected candidate. The equivalent would by a violent coup overthrowing Trump, and all the pro trump states declaring independence. Yanukovych won every district in the Donbass and was then overthrown in a illegal coup

    Reply
  69. The Donbass voted for the candidate that promised conservative policies and pro Russian policies. The people of Donbass may be Ukrainian majority but 40{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} are Russian. They left Ukraine and declared independence because Ukraine overthrew the democratically elected candidate. The equivalent would by a violent coup overthrowing Trump and all the pro trump states declaring independence. Yanukovych won every district in the Donbass and was then overthrown in a illegal coup

    Reply
  70. No it’s not, look up the history Crimea has always been a Russian territory. Due to difficulties of administrating Crimea from Russia, jurisdiction was handed over to Ukraine But at no point was it given to Ukraine. The equivalent would be the US making a deal with Canada to administer Alaska Crimea has and always will be Russian territory

    Reply
  71. No it’s not look up the history Crimea has always been a Russian territory. Due to difficulties of administrating Crimea from Russia jurisdiction was handed over to Ukraine But at no point was it given to Ukraine. The equivalent would be the US making a deal with Canada to administer Alaska Crimea has and always will be Russian territory

    Reply
  72. No it’s not, look up the history Crimea has always been a Russian territory. Due to difficulties of administrating Crimea from Russia, jurisdiction was handed over to Ukraine But at no point was it given to Ukraine. The equivalent would be the US making a deal with Canada to administer Alaska Crimea has and always will be Russian territory

    Reply
  73. No it’s not look up the history Crimea has always been a Russian territory. Due to difficulties of administrating Crimea from Russia jurisdiction was handed over to Ukraine But at no point was it given to Ukraine. The equivalent would be the US making a deal with Canada to administer Alaska Crimea has and always will be Russian territory

    Reply
  74. “Ukraine offers a myriad of benefits for international tech startups: the lowest operating costs in Europe, professionals with European sensibilities, easy-to-obtain work permits and no visa requirements, and streamlined recruiting hiring processes, among others.” Does not let me to provide a link.

    Reply
  75. GDP in Poland has not leveled off and keeps growing at about 4% per year. Business climate in Ukraine has actually been praised in recent years and is one of the reasons Ukraine has become IT startup hub.

    Reply
  76. I understand that no country wants to give up its teritory, but either way some kind of a deal must be negotiated, some things must be sacrifaced. As long as there will be war, there will be no serious investments, GDP growth will be well below its true potential, young people will be moving to Poland and other EU countries, the wealth gap between EU and Ukraine will be growing, EU and NATO membership progress will be frozen and ultimately people will need to wait a lot longer to achieve prosperity.

    Reply
  77. I understand that no country wants to give up its teritory but either way some kind of a deal must be negotiated some things must be sacrifaced. As long as there will be war there will be no serious investments GDP growth will be well below its true potential young people will be moving to Poland and other EU countries the wealth gap between EU and Ukraine will be growing EU and NATO membership progress will be frozen and ultimately people will need to wait a lot longer to achieve prosperity.

    Reply
  78. I understand that no country wants to give up its teritory, but either way some kind of a deal must be negotiated, some things must be sacrifaced. As long as there will be war, there will be no serious investments, GDP growth will be well below its true potential, young people will be moving to Poland and other EU countries, the wealth gap between EU and Ukraine will be growing, EU and NATO membership progress will be frozen and ultimately people will need to wait a lot longer to achieve prosperity.

    Reply
  79. I understand that no country wants to give up its teritory but either way some kind of a deal must be negotiated some things must be sacrifaced. As long as there will be war there will be no serious investments GDP growth will be well below its true potential young people will be moving to Poland and other EU countries the wealth gap between EU and Ukraine will be growing EU and NATO membership progress will be frozen and ultimately people will need to wait a lot longer to achieve prosperity.

    Reply
  80. === I will not comment about: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan BTW. We are happy that Germany isn’t poor. If you don’t know why, read: http://qr.ae/TUGUZz. We are not happy that Russia isn’t in the better condition and saying that we are panicking maybe are exaggerated or maybe are not. Why? https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/descarga.png https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/descarga-11.png?w=640 Do you see the first drop? So what the bitch did? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Soviet_War This is more modern: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/EEU_GDP.svg/1280px-EEU_GDP.svg.png Do you see both drops? So what the bitch did? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbass === BTW2. I’m really proud of Poland. Go, go Poland 🙂

    Reply
  81. === I will not comment about: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan BTW. We are happy that Germany isn’t poor. If you don’t know why, read: http://qr.ae/TUGUZz. We are not happy that Russia isn’t in the better condition and saying that we are panicking maybe are exaggerated or maybe are not. Why? https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/descarga.png https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/descarga-11.png?w=640 Do you see the first drop? So what the bitch did? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Soviet_War This is more modern: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/EEU_GDP.svg/1280px-EEU_GDP.svg.png Do you see both drops? So what the bitch did? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbass === BTW2. I’m really proud of Poland. Go, go Poland 🙂

    Reply
  82. During the siege of Wrocław (Breslau) many buildings were destroyed (including the modernist Wertheim department store). Big damages were also made in: Brzeg (Brieg), Głogówek (Oberglogau), Namysłów (Namslau), Nysa (Neisse) and Żagań (Sagan). To a lesser extent were destroyed: Bolesławiec (Bunzlau), Opole (Oppeln), Prudnik (Neustadt in Oberschlesien) and Racibórz (Ratibor). In addition to areas destroyed by military operations, in 1945 within Poland there were also areas where no military operations were carried out, therefore the cities located on them did not suffer any damage. This is a region of the Sudetenland, seized by the Soviet army only after the surrender of Germany: Jelenia Góra (Hirschberg im Riesengebirge), Kłodzko (Glatz), Wałbrzych (Waldenburg). Lubusz Voivodeship towns, where the hostilities were conducted (were of low intensity and took the form of a pursuit) did not suffer too much during the WWII. As a result of war activities, plunder and arson inflicted by the Red Army in Sulechów (Züllichau) and Rzepin (Reppen), the destruction was estimated at 60% of the urban substance, in Gorzów Wielkopolski (Landsberg an der Warthe) and Żary (Sorau) at 40%, and in Świebodzin (Schwiebus) at 30%. The most damaged city in the Recovered Territories was Kostrzyn nad Odrą (Küstrin), which was completelyrazed to the ground” === The infrastructure https://i.iplsc.com/mapa-sieci-kolejowej-ii-rzeczpospolitej-odziedziczonej-po-za/0002NEV5XJY87C4L-C116-F4.jpg This is a map of railway lines from 1914. Guess which areas were incorporated by which countries? Look at railways leading deep into Russia. Och, Russia we love you from bottoms of our hearts. http://touringklub.pl/forum/download/MAPA_SAMOCHODOWA_STANU_DROG_W_POLSCE_NA_ROK_1936-1937.jpg This is a map of roads in 1936/1937. Look at ground roads at the area where is a modern Belarus. Didn’t I mention that we love Russia? You can always say that the Poles could build asphalt roads. If it was not for WWII it would h

    Reply
  83. During the siege of Wrocław (Breslau) many buildings were destroyed (including the modernist Wertheim department store). Big damages were also made in: Brzeg (Brieg) Głogówek (Oberglogau) Namysłów (Namslau) Nysa (Neisse) and Żagań (Sagan). To a lesser extent were destroyed: Bolesławiec (Bunzlau) Opole (Oppeln) Prudnik (Neustadt in Oberschlesien) and Racibórz (Ratibor). In addition to areas destroyed by military operations in 1945 within Poland there were also areas where no military operations were carried out therefore the cities located on them did not suffer any damage. This is a region of the Sudetenland seized by the Soviet army only after the surrender of Germany: Jelenia Góra (Hirschberg im Riesengebirge) Kłodzko (Glatz) Wałbrzych (Waldenburg). Lubusz Voivodeship towns where the hostilities were conducted (were of low intensity and took the form of a pursuit) did not suffer too much during the WWII.As a result of war activities plunder and arson inflicted by the Red Army in Sulechów (Züllichau) and Rzepin (Reppen) the destruction was estimated at 60{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of the urban substance in Gorzów Wielkopolski (Landsberg an der Warthe) and Żary (Sorau) at 40{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} and in Świebodzin (Schwiebus) at 30{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}. The most damaged city in the Recovered Territories was Kostrzyn nad Odrą (Küstrin) which was completelyrazed to the ground===The infrastructurehttps://i.iplsc.com/mapa-sieci-kolejowej-ii-rzeczpospolitej-odziedziczonej-po-za/0002NEV5XJY87C4L-C116-F4.jpgThis is a map of railway lines from 1914. Guess which areas were incorporated by which countries? Look at railways leading deep into Russia. Och” Russia we love you from bottoms of our hearts.http://touringklub.pl/forum/download/MAPA_SAMOCHODOWA_STANU_DROG_W_POLSCE_NA_ROK_1936-1937.jpgThis is a map of roads in 1936/1937. Look

    Reply
  84. During the siege of Wrocław (Breslau) many buildings were destroyed (including the modernist Wertheim department store). Big damages were also made in: Brzeg (Brieg), Głogówek (Oberglogau), Namysłów (Namslau), Nysa (Neisse) and Żagań (Sagan). To a lesser extent were destroyed: Bolesławiec (Bunzlau), Opole (Oppeln), Prudnik (Neustadt in Oberschlesien) and Racibórz (Ratibor). In addition to areas destroyed by military operations, in 1945 within Poland there were also areas where no military operations were carried out, therefore the cities located on them did not suffer any damage. This is a region of the Sudetenland, seized by the Soviet army only after the surrender of Germany: Jelenia Góra (Hirschberg im Riesengebirge), Kłodzko (Glatz), Wałbrzych (Waldenburg). Lubusz Voivodeship towns, where the hostilities were conducted (were of low intensity and took the form of a pursuit) did not suffer too much during the WWII. As a result of war activities, plunder and arson inflicted by the Red Army in Sulechów (Züllichau) and Rzepin (Reppen), the destruction was estimated at 60% of the urban substance, in Gorzów Wielkopolski (Landsberg an der Warthe) and Żary (Sorau) at 40%, and in Świebodzin (Schwiebus) at 30%. The most damaged city in the Recovered Territories was Kostrzyn nad Odrą (Küstrin), which was completelyrazed to the ground” === The infrastructure https://i.iplsc.com/mapa-sieci-kolejowej-ii-rzeczpospolitej-odziedziczonej-po-za/0002NEV5XJY87C4L-C116-F4.jpg This is a map of railway lines from 1914. Guess which areas were incorporated by which countries? Look at railways leading deep into Russia. Och, Russia we love you from bottoms of our hearts. http://touringklub.pl/forum/download/MAPA_SAMOCHODOWA_STANU_DROG_W_POLSCE_NA_ROK_1936-1937.jpg This is a map of roads in 1936/1937. Look at ground roads at the area where is a modern Belarus. Didn’t I mention that we love Russia? You can always say that the Poles could build asphalt roads. If it was not for WWII it would h

    Reply
  85. During the siege of Wrocław (Breslau) many buildings were destroyed (including the modernist Wertheim department store). Big damages were also made in: Brzeg (Brieg) Głogówek (Oberglogau) Namysłów (Namslau) Nysa (Neisse) and Żagań (Sagan). To a lesser extent were destroyed: Bolesławiec (Bunzlau) Opole (Oppeln) Prudnik (Neustadt in Oberschlesien) and Racibórz (Ratibor). In addition to areas destroyed by military operations in 1945 within Poland there were also areas where no military operations were carried out therefore the cities located on them did not suffer any damage. This is a region of the Sudetenland seized by the Soviet army only after the surrender of Germany: Jelenia Góra (Hirschberg im Riesengebirge) Kłodzko (Glatz) Wałbrzych (Waldenburg). Lubusz Voivodeship towns where the hostilities were conducted (were of low intensity and took the form of a pursuit) did not suffer too much during the WWII.As a result of war activities plunder and arson inflicted by the Red Army in Sulechów (Züllichau) and Rzepin (Reppen) the destruction was estimated at 60{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of the urban substance in Gorzów Wielkopolski (Landsberg an der Warthe) and Żary (Sorau) at 40{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} and in Świebodzin (Schwiebus) at 30{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}. The most damaged city in the Recovered Territories was Kostrzyn nad Odrą (Küstrin) which was completelyrazed to the ground===The infrastructurehttps://i.iplsc.com/mapa-sieci-kolejowej-ii-rzeczpospolitej-odziedziczonej-po-za/0002NEV5XJY87C4L-C116-F4.jpgThis is a map of railway lines from 1914. Guess which areas were incorporated by which countries? Look at railways leading deep into Russia. Och” Russia we love you from bottoms of our hearts.http://touringklub.pl/forum/download/MAPA_SAMOCHODOWA_STANU_DROG_W_POLSCE_NA_ROK_1936-1937.jpgThis is a map of roads in 1936/1937. Look

    Reply
  86. Did you know how Poland looked after WWII (including west Poland)? Sorry, I can’t add pictures https://v.wpimg.pl/MDc4OC5qLjQLayIsWxQ0awobJ2wERXVrDEY2JAFBfXNbDGEpRRY= West and north have a bigger purchasing power. Why? Because they don’t have a lot farmers: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship%2C_2007.jpg/220px-Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship%2C_2007.jpg In PRL west Poland was a land of State Agricultural Farms. Communism fell and ‘chosen ones’ bought from ‘free’ government huge expanses of land. Ordinary people stayed with nothing. Many went to cities. But the most important thing: agriculture in western Poland is condensed, and fragmented in the east. And now about cities in the west. https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zniszczenia_wojenne_miast_niemieckich#Miasta_przekazane_Polsce “Topography of the destruction of German cities In contrast to the scale, the topography of destruction in bombed German cities was very similar. The biggest damage hit the Old Town, medium – downtown, while in the suburbs the destruction was much smaller. There was also a different form of destruction – in many cases, due to the use of bombs igniting buildings had destroyed roofs and burnt interiors, but the walling remained undamaged. Such a form of destruction posed problems in the methodology of calculating damage – for this reason statistics about the destruction of Berlin are very divergent. Cities passed to Poland In the Recovered Territories, small and medium-sized cities suffered the most. The lands in western Poland were plundered by the Soviet army, which treated these areas as war achievements. Soviet troops removed entire industrial plants, machinery and equipment of factories as well as infrastructure elements from cities. Szczecin (Stettin) was destroyed as a result of carpet bombing in 1943-1944 (the first bombing took place on April 20, 1943). At the end of August 1944, the Ol

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  87. Did you know how Poland looked after WWII (including west Poland)?Sorry I can’t add pictureshttps://v.wpimg.pl/MDc4OC5qLjQLayIsWxQ0awobJ2wERXVrDEY2JAFBfXNbDGEpRRY=West and north have a bigger purchasing power. Why? Because they don’t have a lot farmers:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}2C_2007.jpg/220px-Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}2C_2007.jpgIn PRL west Poland was a land of State Agricultural Farms. Communism fell and ‘chosen ones’ bought from ‘free’ government huge expanses of land. Ordinary people stayed with nothing. Many went to cities. But the most important thing: agriculture in western Poland is condensed and fragmented in the east.And now about cities in the west. https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zniszczenia_wojenne_miast_niemieckich#Miasta_przekazane_PolsceTopography of the destruction of German citiesIn contrast to the scale” the topography of destruction in bombed German cities was very similar. The biggest damage hit the Old Town medium – downtown while in the suburbs the destruction was much smaller. There was also a different form of destruction – in many cases due to the use of bombs igniting buildings had destroyed roofs and burnt interiors but the walling remained undamaged. Such a form of destruction posed problems in the methodology of calculating damage – for this reason statistics about the destruction of Berlin are very divergent.Cities passed to PolandIn the Recovered Territories small and medium-sized cities suffered the most. The lands in western Poland were plundered by the Soviet army which treated these areas as war achievements. Soviet troops removed entire industrial plants machinery and equipment of factories as well as infrastructure elements from cities.Szczeci

    Reply
  88. Did you know how Poland looked after WWII (including west Poland)? Sorry, I can’t add pictures https://v.wpimg.pl/MDc4OC5qLjQLayIsWxQ0awobJ2wERXVrDEY2JAFBfXNbDGEpRRY= West and north have a bigger purchasing power. Why? Because they don’t have a lot farmers: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship%2C_2007.jpg/220px-Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship%2C_2007.jpg In PRL west Poland was a land of State Agricultural Farms. Communism fell and ‘chosen ones’ bought from ‘free’ government huge expanses of land. Ordinary people stayed with nothing. Many went to cities. But the most important thing: agriculture in western Poland is condensed, and fragmented in the east. And now about cities in the west. https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zniszczenia_wojenne_miast_niemieckich#Miasta_przekazane_Polsce “Topography of the destruction of German cities In contrast to the scale, the topography of destruction in bombed German cities was very similar. The biggest damage hit the Old Town, medium – downtown, while in the suburbs the destruction was much smaller. There was also a different form of destruction – in many cases, due to the use of bombs igniting buildings had destroyed roofs and burnt interiors, but the walling remained undamaged. Such a form of destruction posed problems in the methodology of calculating damage – for this reason statistics about the destruction of Berlin are very divergent. Cities passed to Poland In the Recovered Territories, small and medium-sized cities suffered the most. The lands in western Poland were plundered by the Soviet army, which treated these areas as war achievements. Soviet troops removed entire industrial plants, machinery and equipment of factories as well as infrastructure elements from cities. Szczecin (Stettin) was destroyed as a result of carpet bombing in 1943-1944 (the first bombing took place on April 20, 1943). At the end of August 1944, the Ol

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  89. Did you know how Poland looked after WWII (including west Poland)?Sorry I can’t add pictureshttps://v.wpimg.pl/MDc4OC5qLjQLayIsWxQ0awobJ2wERXVrDEY2JAFBfXNbDGEpRRY=West and north have a bigger purchasing power. Why? Because they don’t have a lot farmers:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}2C_2007.jpg/220px-Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12}2C_2007.jpgIn PRL west Poland was a land of State Agricultural Farms. Communism fell and ‘chosen ones’ bought from ‘free’ government huge expanses of land. Ordinary people stayed with nothing. Many went to cities. But the most important thing: agriculture in western Poland is condensed and fragmented in the east.And now about cities in the west. https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zniszczenia_wojenne_miast_niemieckich#Miasta_przekazane_PolsceTopography of the destruction of German citiesIn contrast to the scale” the topography of destruction in bombed German cities was very similar. The biggest damage hit the Old Town medium – downtown while in the suburbs the destruction was much smaller. There was also a different form of destruction – in many cases due to the use of bombs igniting buildings had destroyed roofs and burnt interiors but the walling remained undamaged. Such a form of destruction posed problems in the methodology of calculating damage – for this reason statistics about the destruction of Berlin are very divergent.Cities passed to PolandIn the Recovered Territories small and medium-sized cities suffered the most. The lands in western Poland were plundered by the Soviet army which treated these areas as war achievements. Soviet troops removed entire industrial plants machinery and equipment of factories as well as infrastructure elements from cities.Szczeci

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  90. Ukraine has been an ongoing provider of the best tech “brains” (e.g. programmers engineers designers) for the world’s biggest tech companies: Google Microsoft Uber to name a few. Most IT firms in Ukraine reside in 5 major cities—Kyiv Kharkiv Lviv” Dnipropetrovsk and Odessa—accounting for 86{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of the market.”” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/“””””””

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  91. Ukraine has been an ongoing provider of the best tech “brains” (e.g. programmers engineers designers) for the world’s biggest tech companies: Google Microsoft Uber to name a few. Most IT firms in Ukraine reside in 5 major cities—Kyiv Kharkiv Lviv” Dnipropetrovsk and Odessa—accounting for 86{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of the market.”” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/“””””””

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  92. You have been ID-ed as a paid Russian troll working for Prigozhin’s outfit call Internet Research Agency recently indicted by the US department of justice (google internet research agency indictment). You comrade are playing with fire. Also there is nothing wrong with the map.

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  93. You have been ID-ed as a paid Russian troll working for Prigozhin’s outfit call Internet Research Agency recently indicted by the US department of justice (google internet research agency indictment). You comrade are playing with fire.Also there is nothing wrong with the map.

    Reply
  94. You have been ID-ed as a paid Russian troll working for Prigozhin’s outfit call Internet Research Agency recently indicted by the US department of justice (google internet research agency indictment). You comrade are playing with fire. Also there is nothing wrong with the map.

    Reply
  95. You have been ID-ed as a paid Russian troll working for Prigozhin’s outfit call Internet Research Agency recently indicted by the US department of justice (google internet research agency indictment). You comrade are playing with fire.Also there is nothing wrong with the map.

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  96. The reason why Poland is a developed country now is because it left Russian sphere of influence and the same is going to happen to Ukraine only faster since Ukraine has more natural resources and fertile soils etc.

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  97. The reason why Poland is a developed country now is because it left Russian sphere of influence and the same is going to happen to Ukraine only faster since Ukraine has more natural resources and fertile soils etc.

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  98. The reason why Poland is a developed country now is because it left Russian sphere of influence and the same is going to happen to Ukraine only faster since Ukraine has more natural resources and fertile soils etc.

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  99. The reason why Poland is a developed country now is because it left Russian sphere of influence and the same is going to happen to Ukraine only faster since Ukraine has more natural resources and fertile soils etc.

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  100. Ukraine has already become a European IT start up hub second only to UK and Germany in venture capital investment in 2018 overtaking Poland and growing at an incredible speed over the last 3 years despite the war waged and maintained by Russia. ” 7 Reasons Why Ukraine is Becoming a Major Tech Startup Hub.” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/ Ukraine has an incredibly talented and educated young people. Also in contrast to Russia Ukrainians and not lazy and very entrepreneuring people.

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  101. Ukraine has already become a European IT start up hub second only to UK and Germany in venture capital investment in 2018 overtaking Poland and growing at an incredible speed over the last 3 years despite the war waged and maintained by Russia. 7 Reasons Why Ukraine is Becoming a Major Tech Startup Hub.”” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/Ukraine has an incredibly talented and educated young people. Also in contrast to Russia Ukrainians and not lazy and very entrepreneuring people.”””

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  102. Ukraine has already become a European IT start up hub second only to UK and Germany in venture capital investment in 2018 overtaking Poland and growing at an incredible speed over the last 3 years despite the war waged and maintained by Russia. ” 7 Reasons Why Ukraine is Becoming a Major Tech Startup Hub.” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/ Ukraine has an incredibly talented and educated young people. Also in contrast to Russia Ukrainians and not lazy and very entrepreneuring people.

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  103. Ukraine has already become a European IT start up hub second only to UK and Germany in venture capital investment in 2018 overtaking Poland and growing at an incredible speed over the last 3 years despite the war waged and maintained by Russia. 7 Reasons Why Ukraine is Becoming a Major Tech Startup Hub.”” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/Ukraine has an incredibly talented and educated young people. Also in contrast to Russia Ukrainians and not lazy and very entrepreneuring people.”””

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  104. Poland is a developed country and Ukraine looks more like a 3rd world economy. The economy of Ukraine is 5 times smaller than the economy of Poland and the ukrainians are a source of cheap, unskilled labour in Poland. Also, your map is incorrect: Crimea belongs to Russia

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  105. Poland is a developed country and Ukraine looks more like a 3rd world economy. The economy of Ukraine is 5 times smaller than the economy of Poland and the ukrainians are a source of cheap unskilled labour in Poland. Also your map is incorrect: Crimea belongs to Russia

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  106. Poland is a developed country and Ukraine looks more like a 3rd world economy. The economy of Ukraine is 5 times smaller than the economy of Poland and the ukrainians are a source of cheap, unskilled labour in Poland. Also, your map is incorrect: Crimea belongs to Russia

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  107. Poland is a developed country and Ukraine looks more like a 3rd world economy. The economy of Ukraine is 5 times smaller than the economy of Poland and the ukrainians are a source of cheap unskilled labour in Poland. Also your map is incorrect: Crimea belongs to Russia

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  108. William learn history. The part of Germany that fell to Poland was completely ruined after WW2 – just like the rest of Poland. I will add that Poland could not take advantage of the Marshal’s plan.

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  109. William learn history. The part of Germany that fell to Poland was completely ruined after WW2 – just like the rest of Poland. I will add that Poland could not take advantage of the Marshal’s plan.

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  110. William learn history. The part of Germany that fell to Poland was completely ruined after WW2 – just like the rest of Poland. I will add that Poland could not take advantage of the Marshal’s plan.

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  111. William learn history. The part of Germany that fell to Poland was completely ruined after WW2 – just like the rest of Poland. I will add that Poland could not take advantage of the Marshal’s plan.

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  112. So what? Shows how desperate the Poles are to be further backed up by the US military, not less.

    And we shouldn’t take the bait. We should cut a deal with Russia designating what is their close regional sphere of influence and what is ours, and leave the Poles to their geopolitical fate from that.

    There is NO LONGER ANY VIABLE argument for risking cities named ‘Boston’ and ‘Chicago’ for protecting Poland. None. So what if Russia becomes a regional power. It is not the Soviet Union. It is not a world threat to us. Hell, by having to deal with occupied territories it will be bogged down in constant guerilla warfare and that is a net positive for us, geopolitically speaking.

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  113. Russian soldiers also gang-raped every Polish woman they found. Daily. Didn’t matter how young, or old.

    So, aren’t like a 1/3 of modern day Poles have at least 1/4 Russian blood in them now?

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  114. funny enough poland offered to pay for a US base there.. now thats the kind of european country the us should hang with … the western europe economy has seen its heyday thats for sure

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  115. funny enough poland offered to pay for a US base there.. now thats the kind of european country the us should hang with … the western europe economy has seen its heyday thats for sure

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  116. funny enough poland offered to pay for a US base there.. now thats the kind of european country the us should hang with … the western europe economy has seen its heyday thats for sure

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  117. funny enough poland offered to pay for a US base there.. now thats the kind of european country the us should hang with … the western europe economy has seen its heyday thats for sure

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  118. About half of Poland was Germany before 1930, so it’s not surprising it would become prosperous, if allowed to. Actually, if government limit’s itself to dealing with violent, and property crimes, provides title to property, and leaves everything else to the private sector, it’s impossible to avoid prosperity.

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  119. About half of Poland was Germany before 1930 so it’s not surprising it would become prosperous if allowed to. Actually if government limit’s itself to dealing with violent and property crimes provides title to property and leaves everything else to the private sector it’s impossible to avoid prosperity.

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  120. About half of Poland was Germany before 1930, so it’s not surprising it would become prosperous, if allowed to. Actually, if government limit’s itself to dealing with violent, and property crimes, provides title to property, and leaves everything else to the private sector, it’s impossible to avoid prosperity.

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  121. About half of Poland was Germany before 1930 so it’s not surprising it would become prosperous if allowed to. Actually if government limit’s itself to dealing with violent and property crimes provides title to property and leaves everything else to the private sector it’s impossible to avoid prosperity.

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  122. Could someone explain to me, how can GDP per capita increase by 50% in 4 years (by 2023)? That seems to be slightly outlandish.

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  123. Could someone explain to me how can GDP per capita increase by 50{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in 4 years (by 2023)? That seems to be slightly outlandish.

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  124. Could someone explain to me, how can GDP per capita increase by 50% in 4 years (by 2023)? That seems to be slightly outlandish.

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  125. Could someone explain to me how can GDP per capita increase by 50{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in 4 years (by 2023)? That seems to be slightly outlandish.

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  126. Getting into political debates about these 2 countries is a losing proposition. Reminds me when I mistakenly called a Belarus a White Russian (a bad mistake, since it doesn’t mean that). Poland has grown tremendously, but I wonder if it can be sustained. GDP has leveled off the past few years, as has GDP/capita. Can Poland break out of the middle income trap? I doubt it. Poland needs to re-industrialize if you will (with lots of foreign capital). That means competing with everyone else in the same boat. I just can’t see the selling proposition. Which is too bad, I found the Poles among the hardest working and industrious anywhere (and a beautiful lakes district and beaches) . They have a lot going for them (geography, education, work ethic) but the latest plateauing doesn’t point in the right direction. btw, the topic of EU transfers is not that important in the big scheme of things, representing about 2.5% of GDP, it helps, but not material (and compared to Germany’s domestic energy subsidies a rounding error).

    Ukraine is a completely different animal. It imports energy and outputs steel and agri. To me (been in and around Kiev a few times), it’s got to step up to the plate if they ever want to get into the middle income. It means serious reform of the agri sector (which could be huge though Europe doesn’t want it) and some semblance of a decent business climate. It seems the officials go out of their way to discourage FDI.

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  127. The Donbass voted for the candidate that promised conservative policies and pro Russian policies.

    The people of Donbass may be Ukrainian majority, but 40% are Russian.

    They left Ukraine and declared independence, because Ukraine overthrew the democratically elected candidate.

    The equivalent would by a violent coup overthrowing Trump, and all the pro trump states declaring independence.

    Yanukovych won every district in the Donbass and was then overthrown in a illegal coup

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  128. No it’s not, look up the history

    Crimea has always been a Russian territory.

    Due to difficulties of administrating Crimea from Russia, jurisdiction was handed over to Ukraine

    But at no point was it given to Ukraine.

    The equivalent would be the US making a deal with Canada to administer Alaska

    Crimea has and always will be Russian territory

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  129. Putin does not only want Donbas, Putin wants the old Soviet Union back. He will agreed to take Donbas back and he will still want more.

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  130. Putin does not only want Donbas Putin wants the old Soviet Union back. He will agreed to take Donbas back and he will still want more.

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  131. Putin does not only want Donbas, Putin wants the old Soviet Union back. He will agreed to take Donbas back and he will still want more.

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  132. Putin does not only want Donbas Putin wants the old Soviet Union back. He will agreed to take Donbas back and he will still want more.

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  133. The strength of NATO is the fact that many nations belong to it. Once nations start to leave NATO will be too weak to resit Russia.

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  134. The strength of NATO is the fact that many nations belong to it. Once nations start to leave NATO will be too weak to resit Russia.

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  135. The strength of NATO is the fact that many nations belong to it. Once nations start to leave NATO will be too weak to resit Russia.

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  136. The strength of NATO is the fact that many nations belong to it. Once nations start to leave NATO will be too weak to resit Russia.

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  137. Russian economy is not even close to even begin recovering. WHy do you think they all of the sudden raised the pension age? No one wants or needs to keep Russia at bay, the entire civilized world would be happy to work with Russia, facilitating global economy. But not on terms of a new oppressive Empire which would engulf whole of Eastern Europe in a brutal dictatorship that only looks like a democracy on the outside. Grain? LOL..Russian economy survives on gas and oil, and to a lesser degree other minerals such as coal ect… Without these resources Russia would be just like any other 3rd world country, today its simply a 3rd world country with resources. A revolution is not possible in that country, majority of its people live with a slave mentality. What is possible though is a “Kolbasniy bunt”. Meaning once the fridges are empty, that is when Russians will take on to the streets. WIth the way things are going now, that is bound to happen!

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  138. Russian economy is not even close to even begin recovering. WHy do you think they all of the sudden raised the pension age? No one wants or needs to keep Russia at bay the entire civilized world would be happy to work with Russia facilitating global economy. But not on terms of a new oppressive Empire which would engulf whole of Eastern Europe in a brutal dictatorship that only looks like a democracy on the outside. Grain? LOL..Russian economy survives on gas and oil and to a lesser degree other minerals such as coal ect… Without these resources Russia would be just like any other 3rd world country today its simply a 3rd world country with resources. A revolution is not possible in that country majority of its people live with a slave mentality. What is possible though is a Kolbasniy bunt””. Meaning once the fridges are empty”” that is when Russians will take on to the streets. WIth the way things are going now”” that is bound to happen!”””””””

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  139. Russian economy is not even close to even begin recovering. WHy do you think they all of the sudden raised the pension age? No one wants or needs to keep Russia at bay, the entire civilized world would be happy to work with Russia, facilitating global economy. But not on terms of a new oppressive Empire which would engulf whole of Eastern Europe in a brutal dictatorship that only looks like a democracy on the outside. Grain? LOL..Russian economy survives on gas and oil, and to a lesser degree other minerals such as coal ect… Without these resources Russia would be just like any other 3rd world country, today its simply a 3rd world country with resources. A revolution is not possible in that country, majority of its people live with a slave mentality. What is possible though is a “Kolbasniy bunt”. Meaning once the fridges are empty, that is when Russians will take on to the streets. WIth the way things are going now, that is bound to happen!

    Reply
  140. Russian economy is not even close to even begin recovering. WHy do you think they all of the sudden raised the pension age? No one wants or needs to keep Russia at bay the entire civilized world would be happy to work with Russia facilitating global economy. But not on terms of a new oppressive Empire which would engulf whole of Eastern Europe in a brutal dictatorship that only looks like a democracy on the outside. Grain? LOL..Russian economy survives on gas and oil and to a lesser degree other minerals such as coal ect… Without these resources Russia would be just like any other 3rd world country today its simply a 3rd world country with resources. A revolution is not possible in that country majority of its people live with a slave mentality. What is possible though is a Kolbasniy bunt””. Meaning once the fridges are empty”” that is when Russians will take on to the streets. WIth the way things are going now”” that is bound to happen!”””””””

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  141. WHy in the world would Ukraine give up its own territory? U do understand that this is not about Donbas right? THe plan was not Donbas, not even Crimea. THe plan was at LEAST, ENTIRE EASTERN UKRAINE WITH ODESSA. Ukraine lost thousands of soldiers and civilians fighting for DOnbas, no way in hell is anybody ever going to give up on their own territory. Also u are wrong, about 70% of all Donbas residents are ethnic Ukrainians. Yes there is a significant minority that supports Russia, but all in all there are more pro Ukrainian residents. It was Donbas men who formed some of the first volunteer battallions numbering in the thousands, and guess what. THEY ALL SPOKE RUSSIAN. Not to mention there are also thousands of ethnic Russians fighting for Ukraine in its army aswell from all over Ukraine. Russia doesn’t just want Donbas, Russia needs entire Eastern Ukraine with a corridor to Crimea. You don’t understand the full scope of the situation if u are saying things like ” Ukraine should just give up its rightful territory to another country”.

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  142. WHy in the world would Ukraine give up its own territory? U do understand that this is not about Donbas right? THe plan was not Donbas not even Crimea. THe plan was at LEAST ENTIRE EASTERN UKRAINE WITH ODESSA. Ukraine lost thousands of soldiers and civilians fighting for DOnbas no way in hell is anybody ever going to give up on their own territory. Also u are wrong about 70{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of all Donbas residents are ethnic Ukrainians. Yes there is a significant minority that supports Russia but all in all there are more pro Ukrainian residents. It was Donbas men who formed some of the first volunteer battallions numbering in the thousands and guess what. THEY ALL SPOKE RUSSIAN. Not to mention there are also thousands of ethnic Russians fighting for Ukraine in its army aswell from all over Ukraine. Russia doesn’t just want Donbas Russia needs entire Eastern Ukraine with a corridor to Crimea. You don’t understand the full scope of the situation if u are saying things like Ukraine should just give up its rightful territory to another country””.”””

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  143. WHy in the world would Ukraine give up its own territory? U do understand that this is not about Donbas right? THe plan was not Donbas, not even Crimea. THe plan was at LEAST, ENTIRE EASTERN UKRAINE WITH ODESSA. Ukraine lost thousands of soldiers and civilians fighting for DOnbas, no way in hell is anybody ever going to give up on their own territory. Also u are wrong, about 70% of all Donbas residents are ethnic Ukrainians. Yes there is a significant minority that supports Russia, but all in all there are more pro Ukrainian residents. It was Donbas men who formed some of the first volunteer battallions numbering in the thousands, and guess what. THEY ALL SPOKE RUSSIAN. Not to mention there are also thousands of ethnic Russians fighting for Ukraine in its army aswell from all over Ukraine. Russia doesn’t just want Donbas, Russia needs entire Eastern Ukraine with a corridor to Crimea. You don’t understand the full scope of the situation if u are saying things like ” Ukraine should just give up its rightful territory to another country”.

    Reply
  144. WHy in the world would Ukraine give up its own territory? U do understand that this is not about Donbas right? THe plan was not Donbas not even Crimea. THe plan was at LEAST ENTIRE EASTERN UKRAINE WITH ODESSA. Ukraine lost thousands of soldiers and civilians fighting for DOnbas no way in hell is anybody ever going to give up on their own territory. Also u are wrong about 70{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} of all Donbas residents are ethnic Ukrainians. Yes there is a significant minority that supports Russia but all in all there are more pro Ukrainian residents. It was Donbas men who formed some of the first volunteer battallions numbering in the thousands and guess what. THEY ALL SPOKE RUSSIAN. Not to mention there are also thousands of ethnic Russians fighting for Ukraine in its army aswell from all over Ukraine. Russia doesn’t just want Donbas Russia needs entire Eastern Ukraine with a corridor to Crimea. You don’t understand the full scope of the situation if u are saying things like Ukraine should just give up its rightful territory to another country””.”””

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  145. I understand that no country wants to give up its teritory, but either way some kind of a deal must be negotiated, some things must be sacrifaced. As long as there will be war, there will be no serious investments, GDP growth will be well below its true potential, young people will be moving to Poland and other EU countries, the wealth gap between EU and Ukraine will be growing, EU and NATO membership progress will be frozen and ultimately people will need to wait a lot longer to achieve prosperity.

    Reply
  146. ===
    I will not comment about:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan

    BTW. We are happy that Germany isn’t poor. If you don’t know why, read: http://qr.ae/TUGUZz. We are not happy that Russia isn’t in the better condition and saying that we are panicking maybe are exaggerated or maybe are not. Why?
    https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/descarga.png
    https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/descarga-11.png?w=640
    Do you see the first drop? So what the bitch did?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Soviet_War

    This is more modern:
    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/EEU_GDP.svg/1280px-EEU_GDP.svg.png

    Do you see both drops? So what the bitch did?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbass

    ===
    BTW2. I’m really proud of Poland. Go, go Poland 🙂

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  147. During the siege of Wrocław (Breslau) many buildings were destroyed (including the modernist Wertheim department store). Big damages were also made in: Brzeg (Brieg), Głogówek (Oberglogau), Namysłów (Namslau), Nysa (Neisse) and Żagań (Sagan). To a lesser extent were destroyed: Bolesławiec (Bunzlau), Opole (Oppeln), Prudnik (Neustadt in Oberschlesien) and Racibórz (Ratibor). In addition to areas destroyed by military operations, in 1945 within Poland there were also areas where no military operations were carried out, therefore the cities located on them did not suffer any damage. This is a region of the Sudetenland, seized by the Soviet army only after the surrender of Germany: Jelenia Góra (Hirschberg im Riesengebirge), Kłodzko (Glatz), Wałbrzych (Waldenburg). Lubusz Voivodeship towns, where the hostilities were conducted (were of low intensity and took the form of a pursuit) did not suffer too much during the WWII.

    As a result of war activities, plunder and arson inflicted by the Red Army in Sulechów (Züllichau) and Rzepin (Reppen), the destruction was estimated at 60% of the urban substance, in Gorzów Wielkopolski (Landsberg an der Warthe) and Żary (Sorau) at 40%, and in Świebodzin (Schwiebus) at 30%. The most damaged city in the Recovered Territories was Kostrzyn nad Odrą (Küstrin), which was completelyrazed to the ground”
    ===
    The infrastructure
    https://i.iplsc.com/mapa-sieci-kolejowej-ii-rzeczpospolitej-odziedziczonej-po-za/0002NEV5XJY87C4L-C116-F4.jpg
    This is a map of railway lines from 1914. Guess which areas were incorporated by which countries? Look at railways leading deep into Russia. Och, Russia we love you from bottoms of our hearts.
    http://touringklub.pl/forum/download/MAPA_SAMOCHODOWA_STANU_DROG_W_POLSCE_NA_ROK_1936-1937.jpg
    This is a map of roads in 1936/1937. Look at ground roads at the area where is a modern Belarus. Didn’t I mention that we love Russia? You can always say that the Poles could build asphalt roads. If it was not for WWII it would happen.
    Och and other thing. Many Poles from the west work in Germany – it’s closer then from the border with Belarus.
    https://eloblog.pl/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/PKP1952-53.jpg
    This is a map of railways from 1952/1953.
    ===
    The progress
    https://external-preview.redd.it/pkis13A727TE_wheL9YmgXfn4VAeNnHLiMcI_nfGOPg.png?s=04855bda25eecf86db631daf3361aa58768c7c9d
    In the 1925 we were the second poorest country in the Europe (only Russia was poorer). In 1938 we were a lot better.

    https://i.imgur.com/M0M9a5x.png
    And now look at Czechoslovakia and the Baltic States. You can ask Czechs, why they hate USSR? Hint: Soviets removed industrial plants, machinery and equipment of factories.

    part-2

    Reply
  148. Did you know how Poland looked after WWII (including west Poland)?

    Sorry, I can’t add pictures

    https://v.wpimg.pl/MDc4OC5qLjQLayIsWxQ0awobJ2wERXVrDEY2JAFBfXNbDGEpRRY=

    West and north have a bigger purchasing power. Why? Because they don’t have a lot farmers:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship%2C_2007.jpg/220px-Agricultural_employment_of_Poland_by_voivodeship%2C_2007.jpg

    In PRL west Poland was a land of State Agricultural Farms. Communism fell and ‘chosen ones’ bought from ‘free’ government huge expanses of land. Ordinary people stayed with nothing. Many went to cities. But the most important thing: agriculture in western Poland is condensed, and fragmented in the east.

    And now about cities in the west.

    https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zniszczenia_wojenne_miast_niemieckich#Miasta_przekazane_Polsce

    “Topography of the destruction of German cities

    In contrast to the scale, the topography of destruction in bombed German cities was very similar. The biggest damage hit the Old Town, medium – downtown, while in the suburbs the destruction was much smaller. There was also a different form of destruction – in many cases, due to the use of bombs igniting buildings had destroyed roofs and burnt interiors, but the walling remained undamaged. Such a form of destruction posed problems in the methodology of calculating damage – for this reason statistics about the destruction of Berlin are very divergent.

    Cities passed to Poland

    In the Recovered Territories, small and medium-sized cities suffered the most. The lands in western Poland were plundered by the Soviet army, which treated these areas as war achievements. Soviet troops removed entire industrial plants, machinery and equipment of factories as well as infrastructure elements from cities.

    Szczecin (Stettin) was destroyed as a result of carpet bombing in 1943-1944 (the first bombing took place on April 20, 1943). At the end of August 1944, the Old Town, residential districts in the city center and near the shipyard were destroyed. As a result of the bombing, 30,000 people were killed. Industrial facilities were ruined in 90%, the port along with its adjoining areas 70-80%, urban development 60-70%.

    Gdańsk (Danzig) did not suffer significantly during allied bombings. During the Soviet offensive in 1945 about 90% of the historic downtown was destroyed. The reconstructions of center began in 1948 and lasted until the end of the 1980s.

    During the siege of Wrocław many buildings were destroyed (including the modernist Wertheim department store). Big damages were also made in: Brzeg, Głogówek, Namysłów, Nysa and Żagań. To a lesser extent, Bolesławiec, Opole, Prudnik and Racibórz were destroyed [7]. In addition to areas destroyed by military operations, in 1945 within Poland there were also areas where no military op

    part-1

    Reply
  149. You have been ID-ed as a paid Russian troll working for Prigozhin’s outfit call Internet Research Agency recently indicted by the US department of justice (google internet research agency indictment). You comrade are playing with fire.
    Also there is nothing wrong with the map.

    Reply
  150. The reason why Poland is a developed country now is because it left Russian sphere of influence and the same is going to happen to Ukraine only faster since Ukraine has more natural resources and fertile soils etc.

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  151. Ukraine has already become a European IT start up hub second only to UK and Germany in venture capital investment in 2018 overtaking Poland and growing at an incredible speed over the last 3 years despite the war waged and maintained by Russia. ” 7 Reasons Why Ukraine is Becoming a Major Tech Startup Hub.” https://www.techflier.com/2017/06/01/7-reasons-why-ukraine-is-becoming-a-major-tech-startup-hub/
    Ukraine has an incredibly talented and educated young people. Also in contrast to Russia Ukrainians and not lazy and very entrepreneuring people.

    Reply
  152. The emergence of Poland as a great trading partner is phenomenal for Europe. I guess the EU is working in their favor for trade and job growth. The only small issue in Poland is job availability from my talkings with other Pols from Poland.

    Reply
  153. The emergence of Poland as a great trading partner is phenomenal for Europe. I guess the EU is working in their favor for trade and job growth. The only small issue in Poland is job availability from my talkings with other Pols from Poland.

    Reply
  154. The emergence of Poland as a great trading partner is phenomenal for Europe. I guess the EU is working in their favor for trade and job growth. The only small issue in Poland is job availability from my talkings with other Pols from Poland.

    Reply
  155. The emergence of Poland as a great trading partner is phenomenal for Europe. I guess the EU is working in their favor for trade and job growth. The only small issue in Poland is job availability from my talkings with other Pols from Poland.

    Reply
  156. Well, surpassing Greece is nothing to brag about. And why does one need to compare PPP between other Euro-using or Euro-pegged currencies given how the Polish zloty is basically linked to the Euro? (not strongly, but not a huge trading band is allowed for it to leave, either) And if they are doing so well, they don’t need us in NATO anymore, either.

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  157. Well surpassing Greece is nothing to brag about. And why does one need to compare PPP between other Euro-using or Euro-pegged currencies given how the Polish zloty is basically linked to the Euro? (not strongly but not a huge trading band is allowed for it to leave either)And if they are doing so well they don’t need us in NATO anymore either.

    Reply
  158. Well, surpassing Greece is nothing to brag about. And why does one need to compare PPP between other Euro-using or Euro-pegged currencies given how the Polish zloty is basically linked to the Euro? (not strongly, but not a huge trading band is allowed for it to leave, either) And if they are doing so well, they don’t need us in NATO anymore, either.

    Reply
  159. Well surpassing Greece is nothing to brag about. And why does one need to compare PPP between other Euro-using or Euro-pegged currencies given how the Polish zloty is basically linked to the Euro? (not strongly but not a huge trading band is allowed for it to leave either)And if they are doing so well they don’t need us in NATO anymore either.

    Reply
  160. Not 12k but 16k in nominal (2018) assuming 3-4% GDP growth from last year IMF predictions. So far it is above 5% in Q1 and Q2. 31k in PPP PPP is more relevant, yeah some people buy iPhone and they must pay in $ but most things and services are bought on local market and payed for in local currency, so PPP per capita is much better way of showing actual standard of living in medium sized and large countries. Nominal GDP is more relevant for tiny countries with less than 5 million people and tiny local markets, their economy/market is not diverse enough to be self sufficient. Time will tell, these are just predictions.

    Reply
  161. Not 12k but 16k in nominal (2018) assuming 3-4{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} GDP growth from last year IMF predictions.So far it is above 5{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in Q1 and Q2.31k in PPPPPP is more relevant yeah some people buy iPhone and they must pay in $ but most things and services are bought on local market and payed for in local currency so PPP per capita is much better way of showing actual standard of living in medium sized and large countries. Nominal GDP is more relevant for tiny countries with less than 5 million people and tiny local markets their economy/market is not diverse enough to be self sufficient.Time will tell these are just predictions.

    Reply
  162. Not 12k but 16k in nominal (2018) assuming 3-4% GDP growth from last year IMF predictions. So far it is above 5% in Q1 and Q2. 31k in PPP PPP is more relevant, yeah some people buy iPhone and they must pay in $ but most things and services are bought on local market and payed for in local currency, so PPP per capita is much better way of showing actual standard of living in medium sized and large countries. Nominal GDP is more relevant for tiny countries with less than 5 million people and tiny local markets, their economy/market is not diverse enough to be self sufficient. Time will tell, these are just predictions.

    Reply
  163. Not 12k but 16k in nominal (2018) assuming 3-4{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} GDP growth from last year IMF predictions.So far it is above 5{22800fc54956079738b58e74e4dcd846757aa319aad70fcf90c97a58f3119a12} in Q1 and Q2.31k in PPPPPP is more relevant yeah some people buy iPhone and they must pay in $ but most things and services are bought on local market and payed for in local currency so PPP per capita is much better way of showing actual standard of living in medium sized and large countries. Nominal GDP is more relevant for tiny countries with less than 5 million people and tiny local markets their economy/market is not diverse enough to be self sufficient.Time will tell these are just predictions.

    Reply
  164. You wish. ! In GDP PPP Europe is bigger than the US and so is China As a side note “Poland could pass Italy in GDP per capita within 10 years.” Poland is now 12000USD Italy almost twice as that

    Reply
  165. You wish. ! In GDP PPP Europe is bigger than the US and so is China As a side note Poland could pass Italy in GDP per capita within 10 years.”” Poland is now 12000USD Italy almost twice as that”””

    Reply
  166. You wish. ! In GDP PPP Europe is bigger than the US and so is China As a side note “Poland could pass Italy in GDP per capita within 10 years.” Poland is now 12000USD Italy almost twice as that

    Reply
  167. You wish. ! In GDP PPP Europe is bigger than the US and so is China As a side note Poland could pass Italy in GDP per capita within 10 years.”” Poland is now 12000USD Italy almost twice as that”””

    Reply
  168. And all that achieved without accumulation of wealth from centuries of colonization, slavery and gunboat diplomacy. Despite of decades of living under extremely economically unefficient Russia style communism system, thanks to which Central and Eastern Europe wasted so much time on sluggish growth. Stronger and richer Central/East EU is stronger and safer EU and more broadly West. Ukraine should give up Donbas, there is no way Putin will give it back, other reason is simply that people living there do not want to merge with West. They prefer Russian culture and want to be Russia’s province. If Ukraine can struck a deal with Russia and officialy end this silly war, it can become part of EU/West before 2025.

    Reply
  169. And all that achieved without accumulation of wealth from centuries of colonization slavery and gunboat diplomacy. Despite of decades of living under extremely economically unefficient Russia style communism system thanks to which Central and Eastern Europe wasted so much time on sluggish growth.Stronger and richer Central/East EU is stronger and safer EU and more broadly West.Ukraine should give up Donbas there is no way Putin will give it back other reason is simply that people living there do not want to merge with West. They prefer Russian culture and want to be Russia’s province.If Ukraine can struck a deal with Russia and officialy end this silly war it can become part of EU/West before 2025.

    Reply
  170. And all that achieved without accumulation of wealth from centuries of colonization, slavery and gunboat diplomacy. Despite of decades of living under extremely economically unefficient Russia style communism system, thanks to which Central and Eastern Europe wasted so much time on sluggish growth. Stronger and richer Central/East EU is stronger and safer EU and more broadly West. Ukraine should give up Donbas, there is no way Putin will give it back, other reason is simply that people living there do not want to merge with West. They prefer Russian culture and want to be Russia’s province. If Ukraine can struck a deal with Russia and officialy end this silly war, it can become part of EU/West before 2025.

    Reply
  171. And all that achieved without accumulation of wealth from centuries of colonization slavery and gunboat diplomacy. Despite of decades of living under extremely economically unefficient Russia style communism system thanks to which Central and Eastern Europe wasted so much time on sluggish growth.Stronger and richer Central/East EU is stronger and safer EU and more broadly West.Ukraine should give up Donbas there is no way Putin will give it back other reason is simply that people living there do not want to merge with West. They prefer Russian culture and want to be Russia’s province.If Ukraine can struck a deal with Russia and officialy end this silly war it can become part of EU/West before 2025.

    Reply
  172. Poland is a developed country and Ukraine looks more like a 3rd world economy. The economy of Ukraine is 5 times smaller than the economy of Poland and the ukrainians are a source of cheap, unskilled labour in Poland. Also, your map is incorrect: Crimea belongs to Russia

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  173. William learn history. The part of Germany that fell to Poland was completely ruined after WW2 – just like the rest of Poland. I will add that Poland could not take advantage of the Marshal’s plan.

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  174. Before anyone get too excited, Russia GDP has already started to recover due to modernization and huge increases in agricultural production. Recently they have taken back from the US the title of the world biggest grain exporter. Their revenue from agriculture has also passed that of natural gas. To keep Russia at bay Europe and everyone that is affiliated with the cause of free world need to stop buying grain from Russia.

    Reply
  175. Before anyone get too excited Russia GDP has already started to recover due to modernization and huge increases in agricultural production. Recently they have taken back from the US the title of the world biggest grain exporter. Their revenue from agriculture has also passed that of natural gas. To keep Russia at bay Europe and everyone that is affiliated with the cause of free world need to stop buying grain from Russia.

    Reply
  176. funny enough poland offered to pay for a US base there.. now thats the kind of european country the us should hang with … the western europe economy has seen its heyday thats for sure

    Reply
  177. About half of Poland was Germany before 1930, so it’s not surprising it would become prosperous, if allowed to. Actually, if government limit’s itself to dealing with violent, and property crimes, provides title to property, and leaves everything else to the private sector, it’s impossible to avoid prosperity.

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  178. Russian economy is not even close to even begin recovering. WHy do you think they all of the sudden raised the pension age? No one wants or needs to keep Russia at bay, the entire civilized world would be happy to work with Russia, facilitating global economy. But not on terms of a new oppressive Empire which would engulf whole of Eastern Europe in a brutal dictatorship that only looks like a democracy on the outside. Grain? LOL..Russian economy survives on gas and oil, and to a lesser degree other minerals such as coal ect… Without these resources Russia would be just like any other 3rd world country, today its simply a 3rd world country with resources. A revolution is not possible in that country, majority of its people live with a slave mentality. What is possible though is a “Kolbasniy bunt”. Meaning once the fridges are empty, that is when Russians will take on to the streets. WIth the way things are going now, that is bound to happen!

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  179. WHy in the world would Ukraine give up its own territory? U do understand that this is not about Donbas right? THe plan was not Donbas, not even Crimea. THe plan was at LEAST, ENTIRE EASTERN UKRAINE WITH ODESSA. Ukraine lost thousands of soldiers and civilians fighting for DOnbas, no way in hell is anybody ever going to give up on their own territory. Also u are wrong, about 70% of all Donbas residents are ethnic Ukrainians. Yes there is a significant minority that supports Russia, but all in all there are more pro Ukrainian residents. It was Donbas men who formed some of the first volunteer battallions numbering in the thousands, and guess what. THEY ALL SPOKE RUSSIAN. Not to mention there are also thousands of ethnic Russians fighting for Ukraine in its army aswell from all over Ukraine. Russia doesn’t just want Donbas, Russia needs entire Eastern Ukraine with a corridor to Crimea. You don’t understand the full scope of the situation if u are saying things like ” Ukraine should just give up its rightful territory to another country”.

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  180. The emergence of Poland as a great trading partner is phenomenal for Europe. I guess the EU is working in their favor for trade and job growth. The only small issue in Poland is job availability from my talkings with other Pols from Poland.

    Reply
  181. Well, surpassing Greece is nothing to brag about.

    And why does one need to compare PPP between other Euro-using or Euro-pegged currencies given how the Polish zloty is basically linked to the Euro? (not strongly, but not a huge trading band is allowed for it to leave, either)

    And if they are doing so well, they don’t need us in NATO anymore, either.

    Reply
  182. Not 12k but 16k in nominal (2018) assuming 3-4% GDP growth from last year IMF predictions.
    So far it is above 5% in Q1 and Q2.

    31k in PPP

    PPP is more relevant, yeah some people buy iPhone and they must pay in $ but most things and services are bought on local market and payed for in local currency, so PPP per capita is much better way of showing actual standard of living in medium sized and large countries.

    Nominal GDP is more relevant for tiny countries with less than 5 million people and tiny local markets, their economy/market is not diverse enough to be self sufficient.

    Time will tell, these are just predictions.

    Reply
  183. Russia lives off natural resources not grain and no Russian GDP is not recovering. Expect new sunctions in the next few month to shave off 2 to 3% of the GDP. The comming sunctions were described as being more potent than “tactical nuclear weapons “

    Reply
  184. You wish. !
    In GDP PPP Europe is bigger than the US and so is China

    As a side note
    “Poland could pass Italy in GDP per capita within 10 years.”
    Poland is now 12000USD Italy almost twice as that

    Reply
  185. And all that achieved without accumulation of wealth from centuries of colonization, slavery and gunboat diplomacy. Despite of decades of living under extremely economically unefficient Russia style communism system, thanks to which Central and Eastern Europe wasted so much time on sluggish growth.

    Stronger and richer Central/East EU is stronger and safer EU and more broadly West.

    Ukraine should give up Donbas, there is no way Putin will give it back, other reason is simply that people living there do not want to merge with West. They prefer Russian culture and want to be Russia’s province.

    If Ukraine can struck a deal with Russia and officialy end this silly war, it can become part of EU/West before 2025.

    Reply
  186. Before anyone get too excited, Russia GDP has already started to recover due to modernization and huge increases in agricultural production. Recently they have taken back from the US the title of the world biggest grain exporter. Their revenue from agriculture has also passed that of natural gas. To keep Russia at bay Europe and everyone that is affiliated with the cause of free world need to stop buying grain from Russia.

    Reply
  187. Before anyone get too excited, Russia GDP has already started to recover due to modernization and huge increases in agricultural production. Recently they have taken back from the US the title of the world biggest grain exporter. Their revenue from agriculture has also passed that of natural gas. To keep Russia at bay Europe and everyone that is affiliated with the cause of free world need to stop buying grain from Russia.

    Reply
  188. Before anyone get too excited Russia GDP has already started to recover due to modernization and huge increases in agricultural production. Recently they have taken back from the US the title of the world biggest grain exporter. Their revenue from agriculture has also passed that of natural gas. To keep Russia at bay Europe and everyone that is affiliated with the cause of free world need to stop buying grain from Russia.

    Reply

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