Neil Degrasse Tyson Is Biased Against SpaceX With His NASA Fanboying

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Neil Degrasse Tyson has a poor grasp of business and finance. He also made statements that he knew were not accurate. He knows there was refurbishment and there is reusable. He is also just wrong when he says that SpaceX only has made engineering advances on what was unrealistic in terms of cost.

SpaceX will likely have about 250 launches over 24 months (2023 and 2024) and this is almost double the shuttle launches over more than 20 years. This was done for about $10 billion and profitable STARLINK and a Max of about $2 billion per year in government contracts. The space shuttle cost about $200 billion for 135 launches.

The cost per ton transported by plane has likely decreased by over 90% when considering inflation-adjusted costs from the early days of aviation to now.

Getting ten times more for ten times lower cost might be using the same fundamental technology but putting things together the right way is transformational and critical. It is the scale of lowering the cost of air transport per ton transported from 1930 to 2000.

IBM pioneered many of the pieces of cloud computing over many decades. This was done from the early days of mainframe computers in the 1960 and continuing through the 1980s.

Time sharing
Software as a service
Infrastructure as a service
Server, network, storage virtualization
Middleware
Usage accounting
Remote client access
Client Server Computing
Networking (initially proprietary)
Storage area networking

But it was Amazon AWS that brought it together with the right business models to make the multi trillion cloud computing industry.

Rapid Reusability is not the Same as Recovering and Rebuilding over Many Months

Rapidly reusable in weeks. Days and soon hours is not the same as recoverable and repairable for a billion dollars and months of rebuilding.

The shuttle had three reusable components: the orbiter, the space shuttle main engines (SSME), and the Solid Rocket Boosters (SRB).

Upon landing the orbiter was essentially decertified for flight. The recertification process require over 1 million work hours. Hundreds of thousands of these hours were required to refurbish the thermal protection system (TPS).

The first 13 Space Falcon 9 recoveries had some heat shield and other refurbishment. However, the block 5 Falcon 9 has seen SpaceX master reuse. There is very little maintenance and inspection. SpaceX has turned around and reused a booster in 21 days. The inspection and maintenance times have dropped to about 1000 work hours. This is one hundred to one thousand times better than the Space Shuttle.

The actual refurbishment process for this record-breaking turnaround took only 9 days, according to SpaceX. This indicates that the real turnaround time could potentially be even shorter than 21 days if not for other logistical factors.

Crossing the Atlantic – Time Matters

Crossing the Atlantic in months like Columbus is not the same as container ships crossing in 10-20 days. Columbus version barely lets you start discovering and colonizing North America and other supports a global economy with hundreds of millions of tons of goods traded and multi-trillion economy.

Astronomy Comparison

Our Sun is a G-type star. A star ten times less powerful than a G is a red dwarf.

A star 6 times more powerful (luminous) than a G-type star is an F-type star.

An A-type star is 40 times more luminous than a G-type star.

They are all stars but they go into entirely different categories based on temperature, luminosity, size and other factors.

49 thoughts on “Neil Degrasse Tyson Is Biased Against SpaceX With His NASA Fanboying”

  1. Tyson doesn’t even know what a woman is. If he can’t get the fundamentals right, why should we trust him with anything more complicated?

  2. Just for historical context

    Columbus took 61 days to cross the Atlantic in 1492

    John Cabot (Giovanni Caboto) took about 1 month for a voyage.

    Pedro Alvares Cabral left Lisbon in 9th March 1500, by March 22 they arrived at Cape Verde. They crossed the Equator at 9th March and by 22nd April they officially discovered Brazil.

    • ps, when the entire Portuguese court fled to Brazil before Napoleon invasion, 15 thousand people in total, the voyage took 59 days. But the ships were carrying much more people than possible and the voyage was full of problems. It seems they stopped at Madeira or Azores, for a period, for ressuplying and other questions, so the true travel time is hard to distinguish. Also the Lisbon Rio distance is 7800km, 1000 km less than to Hispaniola (where Columbus sailed to)

      • “I just discovered this awesome italian restaurant yesterday”

        It doesn´t mean I was the FIRST person ever to know about that restaurant’s location. At least the owners and employees knew about it, not counting probably at least their families, friends, etc.

        Guess what, when the Spaniards reached the Aztecs, the Aztecs DISCOVERED the existence of Europeans.

        When scientists discovered about the atom, it’s not like if atoms only started existing at that time.

  4. Neil Degrasse Tyson may be partial, but you Brian are definitely more so.
    Musk achievements are little more than media stunts:
    -SpaceX’s maximally reused piece of equipment has been reused 30 or so times, while years ago, Musk claimed that NOW spaceX would be competing with commercial flight. Commercial flights do approximately 5000-10000 flights in their lifetime and when their are written off is because is not convenient any more to maintain them, not because they explode. Musk is 2-3 orders of magnitudes away from his declared goal yet, you do not seem to mind.
    -A comparable 2-3 orders of magnitude difference between declared targets and results achieved could be seen for the boring company (even higher if we consider that the real target was a vertically integrated underground network of tunnels), and tesla semi (30-40 delivered versus 50000 expected production).
    -For FSD/ SpaceX mission to mars, the ratio is infinite because to date it is not possible to have autonomous cars (and indeed now FSD is “supervised FSD” ) and SpaceX did not reach mars in 2024 (as musk stated in june 2016) nor it is even remotely possible they will do it in the near future.

    And for those impartial and objective readers who will forgive Musk’s pathologic unreliability, please bear in mind that three orders of magnitude is the difference between living in a 10,000 sq ft mansion and an old phone booth.

    -NASA routinely sends unmanned probes to mars. If spaceX was serious about their target, they would have sent a probe as a tech demonstrator (or with payloads). They cannot do it.
    -If tesla was serious about FSD they would have accepted liability for the accidents (as European car manufacturers did). And tesla does not.
    -If the boring company was truly about efficient mass transport they would have ditched individual cars for autonomous trains (I lived in lausanne and they have an autonomous metro line since at least 15 years). They did not do it.

    I do not like Neil Degrasse Tyson, but musk fanboys seem to ignore all the very clear points above.

    • “NASA routinely sends unmanned probes to mars.”

      Routinely is a bit of an exaggeration. And they’ve had a fair number of failures.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_missions_to_Mars

      Musk is running commercial companies, with Mars colonization as a side project. Unless the government wants to pay him to go to Mars, he has to do it as the money is available. So he decided to wait until he had a more cost-effective launch platform.

    • The rocket company leaders and experts laughed when Elon said he would dominate Ariane CEO said reusability on rocket boosters was impossible but IF SpaceX found a way to do it then Ariane would obviously quickly follow and copy. First soft ocean simulated landing was 2014, first successful landing and recovery of an orbital booster was Dec 2015.

  5. Tyson is a captured ‘expert’ and a token on display. He is a mouthpiece of the D party. He literally represents the establishment, thus the condescending tone he takes in every statement he makes. Disregard Tyson’s opinion on any popular science (gender fluidity, climate change, etc.).

  6. Tyson is biased in many topics. As far as I know, all of them with a clear politic smell and some of them against empirical facts. And tyson is not a “hard” scientific. He is a communicator and an influencer, that´s all.
    Musk political opinions are different of Tyson ones, hence for Tyson, Musk must be wrong because he thinks that he is “in the right side of the question”. That´s allways the same and it is boring.

  7. [ “But in this case, the ionospheric hole was created “due to the shock wave generated by the Starship explosion,” which temporarily scattered the free electrons within the ionosphere, essentially stripping the plasma of its normal properties, the researchers wrote.”
    ‘ https://www.livescience.com/space/space-exploration/catastrophic-spacex-starship-explosion-tore-a-hole-in-the-atmosphere-last-year-in-1st-of-its-kind-event-russian-scientists-reveal ‘

    It could be very interesting, if Starship&Booster launches would measure air mix (or plasma properties) on different altitudes with different flight plans and locations? From my POV, for that, there’s scientific data missing(?) ]

    • [ maybe another request:
      “Multiple satellites and international ground-based stations observed the disturbance, which lasted for 30 to 40 minutes before the affected part of the ionosphere fully recovered, the researchers wrote.”

      How did they observe that degree of anomaly (density variations -> lensing effects?, conductivity variations <- satellites moving through that volumes?)¿ (thx)

      ("IONOSPHERIC HOLES: A REVIEW OF THEORY AND RECENT EXPERIMENTS", Mendillo, 1988: Routine Faraday rotation measurements from the geostationary satellite ATS-3, used to obtain ionospheric total electron content (TEC) from a midlatitude site) ]

    • [ “The United State’s Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) conducted an environmental assessment on the potential impact of SpaceX Falcon launches from the Kennedy Space Center and the Cape Canaveral Air Force Station in Brevard County, Florida.”

      ‘ https://www.breeze-technologies.de/blog/how-much-air-pollution-do-rocket-launches-cause/ ‘

      “As can be seen in the figure above, there were no exceedances of the NAAQS throughout the years at a primary NASA launch centre. It would be easy to say that rocket launches in fact do not have a significant impact on ground-level air quality; however, this data is for ambient air pollution. This means that we do not know what the exact air quality impact of individual launches are.”
      “Once again, there remains a lack of data surrounding propellant emissions. It would be great if space companies and government agencies could see space exploration as the environmental risk it is and devote time and resources into collecting air quality data around launch sites. Preventive measures and interventions are key. Once the space tourism industry grows into the billions, it may be too late.” ]

  8. Tyson sows doubt that SpaceX going to Mars will be anything other than a one-time stunt because, in Tyson’s mind there is no profit to be made on Mars therefore it is unsustainable. What he is willingly blind to is that Elon has designated the profits from Starlink towards building up the infrastructure from Mars and that, from the beginning, he has said that the costs of sending people to Mars will come from the people who go themselves. So, the revenue for settlement will not come from the sake of anything from Mars but it will have been made in markets on Earth previously and then spent for Mars.

    If one wishes an analogy, there are many activities where people spend money to do things without expectation of profit. Paying to go to the ballgame. Tourism. And perhaps the best analogy are retirement communities where people use their savings and spend it on their new homes and who are sustained by savings and there don’t have to support themselves with mining, reality TV, or intellectual property.

    • Maybe I have misunderstood your point about self funding, but I never read a science fiction story where the colony was made up of rich entrepreneurs and of course no Democrats. Sounds like the perfect colony.

      • “but I never read a science fiction story where the colony was made up of rich entrepreneurs and of course no Democrats.”

        Christopher Stasheff’s “The Warlock in Spite of Himself”; The main protagonist actually came from such a colony. There’s one like that in Bertram Chandler’s Rim World series, too. You’ll also see that in some of L. Neil Smith’s novels.

        It’s a reoccurring trope, actually.

  9. Like others, I see that Tyson is a leftist ideologue. His climate “science” is a joke and like most leftists really hate productive people and enterprises as he sees them as rivals to the all-powerful state.

    • Just glad I don’t live in a country where such a huge proportion of people have fallen down this wacko rabbit hole. Science is published. You either accept it as the best source of info we have, like Tyson, or you think your gut and your favourite influencer on X knows better. Tyson may be biased against Musk but given Musk’s irrational conspiracy obsessions, support for Putin and climate disinformation rhetoric, I for one can’t blame him.

      I give credit to Musk for kick starting the EV revolution, but I like so many others now, I won’t be buying a Tesla. Robotaxis aren’t going to help.

      • A stupid false dichotomy. On the one hand, we have crazy leftist ideologists. We have seen everything they bring – regression, the decline of science, constant lies, the normalization of mental deviations, the distortion of culture, pathological hatred of whites. On the other hand, we have a gathering of right-wing semi-fascists a la Putin Trump and their company with a parody of religious fanaticism and strange conspiracy theories. This is the simplest divorce, no matter which option you choose, it is a disaster. The people at the top are simply playing along with each other for the sake of power. They, at the same time, the real agenda lies outside the plane of the false dissotomy that divides people into camps and allows them to control fear of each other.

      • There is a reason to support Russia in all of this. It was all NATO’s fault. Not some rightwing conspiracy.

        Jeffrey Sachs, who literally worked with Russia, Poland, Ukraine and others at the end of the Cold War, AND with the US administration, says that.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWYZpF2ngnc

        Isn´t Nordstream evidence enough that a lot of the anti Russia rethoric is fabrication?

    • The meaning of all this is obvious. This is the construction of global totalitarianism in connection with the rapid development of automation and the loss of the need for human labor, which will lead to a social crisis. The powers that be plan to redirect the hatred of different groups of people against each other by creating different centers of right and left fascism, each of which will justify their actions by the danger of “Enemies”. You will face an eternal war that will serve as an excuse for the endlessly falling standard of living, the constantly growing arbitrariness of the authorities. Oh, we are Russians, we need to fight the West, so if you do not agree, you will go to the camp. Oh, we are democratic Americans, we need to fight for democracy against the fascists from Russia and Trump, if you do not agree, you will go to the camp. By the way, we have a new recruitment of soldiers for the front of the war that has been going on for 25 years, Oceania has always fought with East Asia. The solution to the problems is simple, it is necessary to remove from power and money all radicals from any side, their pastors and sponsors. The right and left, those who bring in migrants from the most degenerate countries by the millions and those who go to white marches, those who shout that genetics has no effect on anything and we are all a social construct, those who shout that God created the earth in 6 days. All ends of the political spectrum must be cleansed. All who incited hatred and conflict must be punished, all who stole money must be punished, all who were engaged in propaganda, scientific and political disinformation must be punished. Oligarchs, politicians, intelligence officers all over the world. This is a global issue, a question of global corruption and global political terror.

  11. It’s not so much that he is a NASA fanboy but he is partisan hack for the Democrats. Elon has been branded as a heretic ever since he supported Trump and allowed free speech on X (Twitter).

        • No. It’s not a matter of which sex you are. It IS when you think you can control “the other”, anything you think your not. Uhm… know what? There are people who we will support the civil rights of. Of people we will never meet. And whose sex I will never be. Know why that matters? Because I care, and give a damn. And as long as I live, I AINT going away. DEAL with it.

      • Definition of hate speech: speech leftists hate.

        Dictators and their thug fanboys will define any speech that they don’t like as hate speech. Question their bad policies, ideology, failures to produce positive results, and their success in producing bad results is the speech they hate. When they call it “hate speech” they are LYING. They knowingly and willfully slander their opponents with the false charge of hate speech to have them imprisoned or worse.

      • Actually Jonathan — as long as the speech doesn’t meet the criteria for slander, libel, false advertising, incitement or conspiracy to commit a crime, or fraud, it actually _is_ protected speech.

        That is why idiots like the KKK are and should be allowed to hold public rallies, as long as their words and actions do not violate the above. The same goes for leftist organizations, as no less an anti communist figure than Reagan affirmed in his testimony before Congress in the 1960s. It’s why dummies like Jack Chick have a right to print their leaflets decrying the evils of heavy metal land the Catholic church, and why slimy Televangelists like Benny HInn have the right to pimp out Jesus for cash on public television( although in fairness, characters like that probably _do_ at least straddle the line of outright fraud by using fake miracles and the promise of material returns from on high to buttress their calls for donations). The entire controversy surrounding flag burning is about whether it violates one of those stipulations by it’s very nature, I.e. whether it intrinsically represents a call to violence.

        Of course, it is obvious that if the speech of groups like the above is protected, the same applies to people who are not outright malicious, who speak out both genuine and valid concern, but with whom others might disagree; school parents concerned over the content of material to which their children are exposed; clinicians and psychologists who question the promotion, practice, and harm vs. benefit to the patient of sex altering treatments and surgeries, as well as the age at which counseling on such measures begins; the belief of people who hold that abortion is abhorrent because it favors the interest of the mother over the interest of a child, and holds that child to be property. And that protection does not stop when the speech concerns issues of politics where policies that align with one view must come at the rejection of the other.

        Free speech means living encountering speech that you find personally offensive in the public square, at any time, for any number of times, without limit. And it means the only counter to that offensive speech is to be willing and able to make the case for your position against it – no matter how self evident it may be – at any time, for any number of times, from now to our dying day.

        Personally, I’m fine with that. We’ve seen the alternative in plenty of countries over the last few centuries, and it always ends in tears and blood, and with truth out of reach for all because those who control the outlets care nothing for truth.

    • Precisely. Blowing a hole in the Democrats’ social media ‘great firewall’ of censorship was utterly unforgivable, Musk has had a big target painted on him ever since.

      • This will make very hard for him to accomplish any goals his enemies can block. In fact, they will be looking for any excuse to nullify him. For life, if possible.

        If the left wins the next election, Musk will be most likely prosecuted for any thought crime they can come up with.

      • Excuse me, but this mean you think social media is “controlled” by the Democrat’s? Pardon me sir, but what planet do you live on? Why is it people who are right wing, never bother to come up with solutions, but bitch and moan about being victims. Victims of that person, or that party, or a phase of the moon for all the f*** I know. I’m a capitalist who believes in the power of free enterprise to predict the future by creating it. I love what SpaceX has done. I hope other companies step forward to make getting and back from space as common as flying across an ocean is today. Then will know, the “real” space age is here. But will we notice that day? If it “works out well”, nope.

        As for Musk and his politics, oh Christ, that’s a whole other issue. Love SpaceX. As for Musk and his politics? I’ll be polite and just say, no comment.

    • LOL, a bit of a stretch uh? Musk is content with banning free speech as long as requested by rightwing regimes in Turkey and India.

    • Would Musk allow fake news regarding Tesla and his other companies, that made the price fall?

      He would probably delete it AND SUE you.

      The same way he sued several brands for their FREE right to not advertise on X…

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